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View Poll Results: Bret Hart vs Kurt Angle, Submission Match
Bret Hart 52 54.17%
Kurt Angle 44 45.83%
Voters: 96. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
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  #11  
Old 01-25-2010, 11:03 AM
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Meanwhile, over half the people who have been put in the ankle lock have been able to reverse it. Hell, AJ Styles alone has reversed or escaped it 10-15 time over the last month or so.

To say that the sharpshooter is easier to escape from than the ankle lock is ridiculous, you have your whole upper body and your free leg to help you get out of it. With that being sad, I think both Angle and Hart would be good enough to escape each other's submissions. I think it comes down to who can do enough damage so that the other guy cannot escape the submission hold.
This is where everyone seems to misread an important fact that I stated in my analysis... when Kurt Angle locks in the "grapes", there is little to no survival and reversal rate.

If you want to compare the Sharpshooter to the Angle Lock, you need to compare them at their deadliest levels. I agree that the Sharpshooter may not compare to the quick version of the Angle Lock, but Kurt is too smart to lock it on Bret without the grapevines being applied. Expect the full devastation of the move in this matchup.

Angle Lock + "grapevines" >>> Sharpshooter
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  #12  
Old 01-25-2010, 12:27 PM
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Leaning towards Angle here.

The thing is, Bret was a great wrestler. Angle was the best wrestler in the world. You're asking Bret to get Angle down on the mat and get a hold on him? Angle won a gold medal down on a mat. Bret is in trouble here as everything he can do Angle can match. Also as it's been said, the ankle lock is much easier to apply. This is going to go for a LONG time, but I'll take Angle getting the Benoit tap, as in Bret is just stuck in the middle of the ring and gives up.
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  #13  
Old 01-25-2010, 12:40 PM
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This matchup is an instant classic, easily going 45 min with a mixture of pure wrestling , near submissions and gutcheck escapes. In the end though I see Hart pile driving Angle and finally slapping the sharpshooter on in the middle of the ring. After several minutes of agony and near escapes Angle is forced to tap. Team Canada picks up their first win
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  #14  
Old 01-25-2010, 01:38 PM
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Ok I am assuming here that we are talking about both of there wrestlers in their prime cause right now a 52 year old stroke victim vs a 41 year old olympic gold medalist in wrestling the answer would be obvious.

Now that being said I still go with Kurt. Bret was the best there was but the best there is, is now Kurt when it comes to submissions. Angle in pro wrestling has been known for the Angle lock but he is capable of so much more due to his amateur wrestling background and he would pull out all the stops against Hart.
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Old 01-25-2010, 01:39 PM
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The Ankle Lock is a much easier move to reverse or counter as it seems everybody does at least two or three times a match against Angle. I think Hart would be wary enough after the first couple of attempts. In response to KB's assertion that Angle is the best wrestler in the world, Edge has won more against Angle than vice versa so would you assume that Edge is better than Bret Hart? If Angle wasn't the best wrestler in the world, he wouldn't have such a low win/loss percentage as he did in the last few years of his WWE career. I don't see either guy tapping but I think Hart can work over Angle's back and neck area just enough to lock on the Sharpshooter and Angle has so much pride that he will pass out rather than submit.
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  #16  
Old 01-25-2010, 04:11 PM
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Leaning towards the Hitman in this one, his style might not be as high impact as Angle's but Bret was a whole different kind of vicous, he'll work your legs and your back for as long as it takes until he can apply the sharpshooter. None of that taking the straps down and yelling nonsensical bollocks into the camera shite. Bret just got on with it.

Now the Ankle lock has been broken an awful lot in the past, and you gotta believe that someone as competent as Bret will find a way out of it everytime, I believe Kurts applied the grapevine to AJ Styles and AJ broke it by doing something very novel, he punched Kurt in the leg until he let go. Pure brilliance. Also Kurt Angle is bald, history has shown that bald men dont fare well in the sharpshooter.

I dunno, my money and vote are with Bret at the moment, I cant think of a way that Angle's going to outdo him in this one.
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  #17  
Old 01-25-2010, 04:38 PM
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Im not even going to read all of the silliness im sure is contained in this thread

Um, Kurt Angle won the fucking olympics, with a fracture in his neck. /thread.

I love Hart as much as anyone, but there is just zero argument to be had. Hey, lets put Bret Hart in a fucking cage fight against Brock Lesnar, and listen to arguments for that, too.
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  #18  
Old 01-25-2010, 04:46 PM
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Angle, even with the neck injuries, is more vicious, and more ruthless than Bret Hart. Angle has always been in top physical shape. With his conditioning and his weight training. He's stronger, faster, and more versatile. Plus he will do anything to win. He's wrestled through broken necks, and every other injury he's ever had. I don't see how he would lose here. He doesn't just have the ankle lock. He's also got submissions from his amateur background as well. Bret Hart is awesome, but he loses this match.
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  #19  
Old 01-25-2010, 04:48 PM
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I have to agree with Team Angle on this one. Bret Hart was methodical, and he was great at working on an extremity throughout the course of a match. The problem was, Bret Hart never faced a man that was as intense int he ring as Kurt Angle.

Angle is simply a monster in the ring, becomming one of the few guys that I can remember to make Hulk Hogan tap out. Yes, Bret Hart won his Submission I Quit match against the likes of Steve Austin, but Kurt Angle made Stone Cold tap out. Kurt Angle is an animal, and will come at Hart like no one ever has before.
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Old 01-26-2010, 06:28 AM
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Im not even going to read all of the silliness im sure is contained in this thread

Um, Kurt Angle won the fucking olympics, with a fracture in his neck. /thread.

I love Hart as much as anyone, but there is just zero argument to be had. Hey, lets put Bret Hart in a fucking cage fight against Brock Lesnar, and listen to arguments for that, too.
If this was a genuine competition, then Angle would obviously win. But if this was a genuine competition, Big Show would win the ladder match by punching his opponent and then climbing it. But this isn't real, it's professional wrestling, and Kurt Angle lost a submission match to Chris Benoit, who is an inferior submission wrestler to Hart.

Bret Hart made a career out of innovatively getting people into the sharpshooter. He pretty much never tapped out, which can't be said of Angle, and unlike Angle he also won matches with the figure four, which makes him far more dynamic in this sort of thing. Harldy anybody moved once the sharpshooter was locked in, fucking everyone makes it to the ropes in the ankle lock. Both of these men have lost the most significant submission matches they ever had, but Hart lost because his brother cheated and Angle lost because he gave up.
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