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  #11  
Old 03-18-2013, 01:16 PM
MasterDebator MasterDebator is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquaman6686 View Post
Anybody who comes in and they need to get a rub should be put over by Ryback. Vince fed everybody in the company to him and he's completely worthless, he should return the favor a few hundred times over.
I'm not entirely sure that Ryback has been proven to be worthless. I'd even argue that the months of squashes, mostly against local jobbers, helped make Ryback, at the very least, a solid mid-carder who got himself and his catchphrase (Why was it OKAY for D. Bryan to get over with the YES! chants, but Ryback's "FEED ME MORE" is somehow hackneyed and cheap?) into the consciousness of most wrestling fans. Furthermore, what truly established star has been buried by Ryback? What, he squashed Heath Slater a few times? Antonio Cesaro? A guy who gets ZERO heat? If you don't like the dude, that's cool, but Ryback is a force and will be easy to rebuild as soon as him and White Snake vanquish The Shield once and for all. Hell, he played a pivotal role in helping The Shield to get over by constantly being obliterated by them! Does anyone even remember that he beat The Miz and Dolph Ziggler way back when? And so what? Are The Miz and Ziggles the proverbial straws that stir the WWE's drink?

Sigh. I don't love Ryback, but I don't get burying the dude. In my opinion, he's over and getting over isn't easy. How many guys squashed no-names for weeks before fizzling out? The sheer fact alone that he was able to transition from jobber-killer to main-eventer is enough to at least require you to take notice. Ryback is in a high-profile match at Wrestlemania with Randy Orton and Sheamus, both former champs. Give the dude a break.

Back on topic: Chris Jericho and Randy Orton are textbook examples of wins and losses not truly affecting a character's status, but the caveat is that both guys are established superstars (Hell, Jericho is one of the best ever). They both seem to win and lose at an equal rate, but like someone above me said, come tonight, the crowd will go ape shit when they hear Orton's music hit and they'll be eating out of Y2J's hand during the six-man tag.

That being said, I think Triple H doesn't get enough credit when it comes to being a guy who has been willing and able in the past in terms of solidifying a wrestler's future with the company. WM 20, 21, and 22 all featured Triple H in the role of starmaker by going down to Chris Benoit, Batista, and John Cena. To explain why those matches were important would be an exercise in futility. HHH has also contributed greatly, along with 20 others, in making The Streak seem like the only insurmountable obstacle in pro-wrestling history.

I know that Trips hasn't always been so gracious when it comes do doing jobs, but on the grandest stage of them all, he doesn't seem to take umbridge with putting guys over. I fully expect this trend to continue at WM29 when Triple H, in my opinion, will go down to Brock Lesnar in a hard-fought, overly brutal, expertly intense contest. I'd also submit that Brock won't be the last guy Triple H gives a rub to.

Looking down the road ahead? It has to be Cena. He so rarely loses clean matches, so when it finally begins to happen at even a minor rate, it should do wonders for whosoever he jobs to.

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  #12  
Old 03-18-2013, 01:54 PM
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ManureTheBear ManureTheBear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDebator
Why was it OKAY for D. Bryan to get over with the YES! chants, but Ryback's "FEED ME MORE" is somehow hackneyed and cheap?
It's not okay, though. At the height of "Yes"-fever, Bryan was annoying as SHIT, more so than Ryback is now. I just thought he milked it so relentlessly, because of his alignment. Remember, Ryback is a face.

What makes "feed me more" worse, though, is that Ryback can't hit five moves without shamelessly trying to lead a "feed me more" chant, while Bryan does the same once or twice only in an appearance. Also, we have to listen to "feed me more" an additional time for most Shield beat-downs, as it has become their adopted unofficial chant. I would not be surprised in the least if Reigns, Rollins and Ambrose huddle together and quietly chant this before big events.

I get that catchphrases (especially audience chants) are very much the thing right now and it also happens to be the Miz's entire strategy for getting over, but it's a lot more fun for the live audience than the tv-crowd. The audience pays more than the tv-crowd, so let them have this one, regardless.

Just for the record, I'm not hating on you, I'm hating on Ryback.

Back on topic:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDebator
I know that Trips hasn't always been so gracious when it comes do doing jobs, but on the grandest stage of them all, he doesn't seem to take umbridge with putting guys over.
This. Losing to Taker twice, because it was better for the company, took character. He's not a saint (he was in the Kliq, after all), but now he's reined in his ego a little.


Last edited by ManureTheBear : 03-18-2013 at 02:02 PM.
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  #13  
Old 03-19-2013, 06:41 AM
Jonyboyuk2 Jonyboyuk2 is offline
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I'd like to see Dolph Ziggler turn face this year and wrestle John Cena. I would like to see him beat Cena at Summerslam in a great match and that should be used as a catalyst to push Ziggler as a main eventer and John Cena's begin his road to the dark side - cumilating at WM 30 - Cena V Taker.

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  #14  
Old 03-19-2013, 06:59 AM
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TheHorndogSays TheHorndogSays is offline
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Cena without question. Cena really doesn't get the credit he deserves for helping elevate other talent. I think back to a Draft special where Cena put on a great match with an up and coming Jack Swagger and made Swagger look great against the then-WWE champion. Same holds true for Miz, Dolph, and Punk to some degree. Back when Punk was just starting the SES angle and starting to rise to power, it was Cena who put wrestled Punk in their first classic. Then of course there was the summer of Cena/Punk in 2011. Look at the Miz. When he split from Morrison everyone was putting him on the future endeavored list. A quick rivalry against Cena and the fans went from "Bye bye Miz" to "Put the title on Miz". With that kind of turnaround how can anyone NOT want to use Cena to help put anyone over?

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  #15  
Old 03-19-2013, 11:29 AM
SaveUsCMPunk SaveUsCMPunk is offline
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What current wrestler would I choose to put someone over?

Cena easily. What does he have left to prove? He'll soon be a thirteen time champion come Wrestlemania. The only thing he hasn't done is win the IC title and win the King of the Ring. (If they ever bring that back. It's only been a few years.) He's also the worst person at putting people over. See last night's Raw as a good example. No one thought Darren Young would win and the PTP haven't looked credible in a long time....but Jesus F'N Christ, did that match have to be an absolute squash?! Surely Darren Young could've gotten some offense in! Great job WWE. Take one half of the most entertaining and charismatic tag teams and feed him to Cena. I guess JTG wasn't available. Yeah, Titus seems to have a bigger upside than Darren, but the match outcome would've been the same. See Cena fans? This is one reason people can't stand Cena. A guy in his position most likely has some say in how he's booked, so I wouldn't put ALL of the blame on Vince and co. (Though he is at fault as well.)

Who is the best Main Eventer at elevating talent?

Well it's kind of hard to call Jericho and Kane Main Eventers at this point, but they both go above and beyond the call of duty for that. I wish Kane wasn't quite this generous because he deserves another World Title reign. Undertaker is pretty good at helping out younger talent or up and coming talent. He's put over guys like Stone Cold Steve Austin, The Rock, Kurt Angle, Triple H, The Big Show, Edge, Batista, Khali, Mankind, Brock Lesnar, John Cena and Randy Orton. Heck, think back to his early career when he helped put over Yokozuna and Mabel. He also made guys like Giant Gonzalez and Diesel look like they could possibly end the streak. Randy Orton has definitely gotten better at elevating talent. He's done jobs for Miz, Mark Henry, Wade Barrett, Alberto Del Rio and Dolph Ziggler. So I'll give him some props for that.

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  #16  
Old 03-19-2013, 06:09 PM
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Cliche, but Cena.

The guy just refuses to lose clean. Every time he does lose its portrayed in a way that he has an excuse, that he should have won and that even though he lost, he's better than his opponent. Even that is rare though.

When he does getting beat clean, like really clean, especially by an up and coming heel, it will be huge. It would have been great for Punk to get that clean win, but all of his victories over Cena were tainted by the style of the finish.

Best current main eventer? Maybe Orton, i guess, if you still want to consider him one. He's put over some good midcard talent...even if he did crush them multiple times after that. Daniel Bryan puts people over and he could slot into the main event quite easily too. There's always Jericho too, even if he's not near the main event now and probably loses too often.

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  #17  
Old 03-22-2013, 03:53 AM
HHHsWetSpot HHHsWetSpot is offline
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How about Taker? When has he ever "created" a star? The last time he jobbed clean was in 2006 or 2007 to The Great Khali (or did he actually job clean to Kane for once too?), which is actually quite pathetic considering the people he's gone over when they needed the rub (Punk in 2009, Angle in 2000, Booker during the Invasion) At least Triple H put over Batista, Beno*t, and Jeff Hardy, but he never should have beaten Punk in 2011 and he needs to return the job and do a few more while he's at it.

The Rock's comeback needs to end with him returning the job to Punk and/or putting over guys like Kofi and Ziggler.

Beating Orton means nothing anymore. Kane beat him clean last year at Mania and Kane was still totally irrelevant until Daniel Bryan saved his career.


Last edited by HHHsWetSpot : 03-22-2013 at 03:55 AM.
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  #18  
Old 03-22-2013, 07:29 AM
theBec2101 theBec2101 is offline
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Like before I think Orton vs Rock should have somehow happened and turned Orton heel and back to "The Legend Killer". Not saying he would have to go over right away but eventually in the next PPV or so.

Kane, in general I think he should go over more over everyone. Just by work history alone. I think he should be one of the top choices to end Undertakers streak if they go that way.

In Brock Lesner there are a few way;
Storyline would be HHH "couldn’t get involved in Brocks matches" so he gets someone to do so. Something likes that. Anyway.
Batista comes back and faces Brock. If Batista is willing to stay he can go over, if not then, well he can still go over. Sorry I’m not a big Lesner fan. Not taking anything away just never had before or still don’t like him. Just don’t know why.
Orton vs Lesner, Orton goes over. I would love to see the F5 reversed with an RKO.

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  #19  
Old 03-31-2013, 01:26 AM
TempestH TempestH is offline
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Alex Riley - He's a solid ring worker with bucketloads of charisma. He's good as a jobber, but a guy of his particular talents should be jobbing to higher profile opponents. HE should be the guy that wrestles the heels in lengthy competitive matches every week, and losing spectacularly. He should be in a spot similar to where Kofi Kingston or The Miz are now.

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