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  #31  
Old 03-22-2018, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
I owe Natalya and Naomi an apology then. I am man enough to admit when I am wrong (it is a rarity, though).
Rare for you to be wrong? Well let's see.

Quote:
Given that, it is true that the only reason Tyson Kidd is still getting paid by WWE is so that he doesn't sue WWE for his injuries, and because he is married to Natalya, and was trained and is the nephew-in-law to Bret Hart.
Wrong. Kidd is an independent contractor. Meaning he isn't covered by workers' comp. He also doesn't have a case under tort law. So WWE could fire him without fear of repercussion.

Quote:
Maybe my comment at the time was that people said that the Bellas only got their jobs by who they were married to (as in, they didn't deserve it).
Wrong. You were saying that people like Natalya need to marry an employee to keep their job because they are ugly. It baffled you that a person you find ugly could keep their job based off merit. Natalya, a veteran presence and was the best woman in the ring for a long time. You said she must have her job due to Kidd and Neidhart because she's ugly and has no redeemable qualities. You said a sexist thing. You weren't being a knight in shining armor. You were being a pig.

Wrong 3 times. Once every paragraph. Perhaps you meant rarely right?

EDIT: But wait, there's more!

Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
It's true though. People only started hating Roman Reigns AFTER it was reported here and on other sites that he was going to be "the guy", Vince's pick to be the next "big thing".

If they always though that Roman couldn't wrestle or was bad on the mike, then why cheer for him in NXT, or when he was part of the Shield?
Because he wasn't overexposed yet. As part of the Shield, he was hidden in tag matches. NXT part is baffling since I'm willing to bet you've seen maybe one match from his time there.

Go back and watch Reigns vs Orton from whatever SummerSlam. That's when the problem started. Fans were into him. They liked him. Then he had a lackluster match. It all went downhill from there. Yes, his in-ring stuff has improved greatly but his mic work hasn't. WWE didn't push him right. He could be a killer. WWE made him talk about tater tots and beanstalks. They need to frame him better.

Quote:
You see, the people who post here have a massive self of their own importance, and think that they decide who the big star will be, not Vince. They carried on and sent abuse on Twitter to WWE, and hijacked shows until Daniel Bryan was in the main event. These fans have a God complex where they think they know who sells, and it is always their favourite guy, no-one else's opinion matters. Hell, many of them say the only reason "Stone Cold" was pushed was that they MADE Vince push Austin to the top, like Vince didn't see Austin as a star already, and was just waiting for the right moment to push him to the moon (like say, Wrestlemania 14).
Prichard has said Vince hated Austin's accent and thought he had no mic skills. The combination of getting over and working hard with Vince led to him being pushed. You're not going to get a sustained pushed if no one reacts. Drew McIntyre's first push died due to lack of reaction.

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Since the subject is Daniel Bryan, I am interested to see what happens if he wins the belt down the track and holds it for over a year. Will the fans still cheer him, or get sick of him as champion, because he isn't an "underdog" anymore, and is too successful (like fans turned on C.M. Punk during his 14-month WWE Title reign). I hope for Bryan's sake, that no site report that Vince is high on him, and he is now "the guy", since then his fans will turn on him, and boo him, since the sheep can't be seen to agree with anything Vince McMahon has ever done.
The fans didn't turn on Punk. He was being cheered by nearly everyone. He turned so he could face Rock as a heel.
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Last edited by therockiswwf : 03-22-2018 at 12:59 PM.
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  #32  
Old 03-22-2018, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
You know, I think a lot of you fans owe an apology to someone, who you put down for years.

Brie Bella.
I disagree. Any issue that I've had with Brie is based on her entertainment value and ability. She is not a good wrestler. She is much better, sure, but at the height of the Bellas, bother her and Nikki were not good.

I don't think anyone was putting Brie down because she wouldn't let Bryan wrestle. If that were the case and I blamed her for it, then yes, I'd owe her an apology. If you had said that fans owe her their thanks, then I would agree. But I don't have anything to apologize for when it comes to Brie Bella.
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  #33  
Old 03-22-2018, 08:32 PM
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I want this to work out for Bryan and that it turns out okay for him. I've been a fan of his work for a long time and I'm glad that he's getting this second chance. That doesn't mean that I won't cringe every time he takes a significant bump but he's been and is being checked out by some of the best specialists in the world so we just have to wait and see.

I guess one reason why there's been such a positive response to this is because it's a genuine "feel good" situation. When you look around, and I don't just mean on internet forums but the world in general, there's virtually nothing but negativity and conflict going on. Whether it concerns entertainment, politics, religion or pretty much anything else, it's all one big hodgepodge of conflict with people at each other's throats over one thing or another. It's nice to hear about something good happening to someone, especially when it concerns them being able to do something they genuinely love. Bryan Danielson comes off as someone that's very genuine and there's so much slime and muck that we all have to trudge through these days, it's just nice to hear something positive for a change.
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  #34  
Old 03-23-2018, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by therockiswwf View Post
Rare for you to be wrong? Well let's see.



Wrong. Kidd is an independent contractor. Meaning he isn't covered by workers' comp. He also doesn't have a case under tort law. So WWE could fire him without fear of repercussion.



Wrong. You were saying that people like Natalya need to marry an employee to keep their job because they are ugly. It baffled you that a person you find ugly could keep their job based off merit. Natalya, a veteran presence and was the best woman in the ring for a long time. You said she must have her job due to Kidd and Neidhart because she's ugly and has no redeemable qualities. You said a sexist thing. You weren't being a knight in shining armor. You were being a pig.

Wrong 3 times. Once every paragraph. Perhaps you meant rarely right?

EDIT: But wait, there's more!



Because he wasn't overexposed yet. As part of the Shield, he was hidden in tag matches. NXT part is baffling since I'm willing to bet you've seen maybe one match from his time there.

Go back and watch Reigns vs Orton from whatever SummerSlam. That's when the problem started. Fans were into him. They liked him. Then he had a lackluster match. It all went downhill from there. Yes, his in-ring stuff has improved greatly but his mic work hasn't. WWE didn't push him right. He could be a killer. WWE made him talk about tater tots and beanstalks. They need to frame him better.



Prichard has said Vince hated Austin's accent and thought he had no mic skills. The combination of getting over and working hard with Vince led to him being pushed. You're not going to get a sustained pushed if no one reacts. Drew McIntyre's first push died due to lack of reaction.



The fans didn't turn on Punk. He was being cheered by nearly everyone. He turned so he could face Rock as a heel.
Firstly, Tyson Kidd is paralyzed because of a wrestling match, so Vince keeps him around so he won't sue.

What I said about Natayla is no different to other posters here saying that the Bellas "married" into the job, and only got to where they were because of looks and who they were involved with, and then they say that Nattie should be pushed instead.

I pointed out that Natalya was married to talent as well (which is true). Also, this was the time after the "Bra-&-Panties" era but before NXT and "The Diva's Revolution" where posters here bagged any good looking Diva as being eye-candy and nothing else. So they made the divide that Divas at that time could be good looking OR good wrestlers, but not both. So if you say these things about me, call out some of the other posters about their prejudice as well (but you won't, because you agree with them).

So, if a wrestler is overexposed, you don't like it. You don't like having one person being the "top guy". Firstly, then why have championships then? Why not just everyone on an equal footing?

You need to have someone who is the "main eventer", the top guy. Also, I bet if your fave, you would change your tune and want him to remain "the guy". So you are full of bullshit.

So Roman has a lacklustre match at "Summerslam" so you all turn on him. So no-one can have a bad match ever, in your opinion. They must produce a five-star classic all the time, or you turn on them. How many five star matches have you wrestled, champ?

The fact is, he could have the in-ring skills of Kurt Angle and the stickwork of the Rock, but you would still be down on him, because he isn't "your guy". You see, you and those like you think that the WWE should revolve around you. You are so arrogant and narcissistic that you believe that Vince should call you for advice how to run WWE, since you think you could do it better? Where did we get to in this world when the customer or the fan stopped being that and thought that they knew better, and went above their station.

If the Rock talked about teetertots and beanstalks, you would wet yourself laughing. I bet if "Stone Cold" said it, it would also get applause from these sheep. But because it isn't someone YOU want, then you refuse to accept him.

You don't want him framed better, you want Roman Reigns buried instead. You won't be happy until he is jobbing to everyone, and isn't on TV. Then you won't have him "shoved down your throats anymore". The only thing that I would love to see shoved down some of the haters throats is Roman's fist until the hater chokes and dies.

As for Punk, fans did write that they wanted someone new as champion, and that Punk has been champion for too long (this is the era where people want the title hot-potatoed, and then they complain about how no-one is made to look strong). Bruno Sammartino wouldn't have got his long title runs in today's WWE without people on here asking for someone new being champion, and it being too "predictable".

Fans never went cold on Punk (since he was still once an indy guy, and smarks like to pretend that they are superior by knowing the names of anyone in pool-hall wrestling companies), but they went lukewarm on him. Punk got his love back from the fans only after he cut that shoot promo, and left WWE and bagged Vince (who is hated by most here).
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  #35  
Old 03-23-2018, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by therockiswwf View Post
The fans didn't turn on Punk. He was being cheered by nearly everyone. He turned so he could face Rock as a heel.
Uh... yeah they had begun to. I thought this was fairly common knowledge.

Even DB had his detractors around here when he finally won the title. Get popular, the haters will rise. Itís human nature. Doesnít matter how good you are. Itís one of the reasons the IWC would be the worst bookers in the world.
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  #36  
Old 03-23-2018, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
Firstly, Tyson Kidd is paralyzed because of a wrestling match, so Vince keeps him around so he won't sue.
Since Kidd can't do workers' comp nor tort, what would he sue for? Injured workers sue for workers' comp. Kidd can't under law.

Quote:
What I said about Natayla is no different to other posters here saying that the Bellas "married" into the job, and only got to where they were because of looks and who they were involved with, and then they say that Nattie should be pushed instead.
If everyone jumped off a cliff, would you do it as well?

Quote:
I pointed out that Natalya was married to talent as well (which is true). Also, this was the time after the "Bra-&-Panties" era but before NXT and "The Diva's Revolution" where posters here bagged any good looking Diva as being eye-candy and nothing else. So they made the divide that Divas at that time could be good looking OR good wrestlers, but not both. So if you say these things about me, call out some of the other posters about their prejudice as well (but you won't, because you agree with them).
I called you out because you called others out. No one else did so I have no reason. Plus I only remembered what you wrote because I responded to that post at the time.

You pointed out her marriage because you thought that was the only reason she had a job.

Quote:
So, if a wrestler is overexposed, you don't like it. You don't like having one person being the "top guy". Firstly, then why have championships then? Why not just everyone on an equal footing?
Reigns was overexposed as in he wasn't fully complete in the ring yet and had a tendency to mess up on the mic. He was put in a spot a bit earlier than he should have been. Too much, too fast.

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You need to have someone who is the "main eventer", the top guy. Also, I bet if your fave, you would change your tune and want him to remain "the guy". So you are full of bullshit.
Nope.

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So Roman has a lacklustre match at "Summerslam" so you all turn on him. So no-one can have a bad match ever, in your opinion. They must produce a five-star classic all the time, or you turn on them. How many five star matches have you wrestled, champ?
I said that's where the problem STARTED. Do you not read? People liked Reigns before that match. During that match, you can tell there's a something isn't right here reaction by the crowd.

Quote:
The fact is, he could have the in-ring skills of Kurt Angle and the stickwork of the Rock, but you would still be down on him, because he isn't "your guy". You see, you and those like you think that the WWE should revolve around you. You are so arrogant and narcissistic that you believe that Vince should call you for advice how to run WWE, since you think you could do it better? Where did we get to in this world when the customer or the fan stopped being that and thought that they knew better, and went above their station.
Uh no. I love Fandango. That guy should never ever be near the main event because I'm not an idiot. If anyone had the mic skills of Rock and ring skills of Kurt, the crowd would do whatever the wrestler wanted them too. Rock was good enough that he was able to turn passionate cheers into boos.

Quote:
If the Rock talked about teetertots and beanstalks, you would wet yourself laughing. I bet if "Stone Cold" said it, it would also get applause from these sheep. But because it isn't someone YOU want, then you refuse to accept him.
So you think the tater tots promo was good? I don't blame Reigns. Vince put him in a position to die.

Rock had a horrid promo once with Austin during the invasion. Rock basically goes you're a poop and you suck. It was awful and way below his standard. Didn't wet myself. Dry as a whistle actually.

Quote:
You don't want him framed better, you want Roman Reigns buried instead. You won't be happy until he is jobbing to everyone, and isn't on TV. Then you won't have him "shoved down your throats anymore". The only thing that I would love to see shoved down some of the haters throats is Roman's fist until the hater chokes and dies.
No, I want him framed better. That spear he did on Big Show was awesome. He was cheered when he beat Sheamus. So he can be portrayed in a way people like but they rarely do it. Play to his strengths and hide his weaknesses.

Quote:
As for Punk, fans did write that they wanted someone new as champion, and that Punk has been champion for too long (this is the era where people want the title hot-potatoed, and then they complain about how no-one is made to look strong). Bruno Sammartino wouldn't have got his long title runs in today's WWE without people on here asking for someone new being champion, and it being too "predictable".

Fans never went cold on Punk (since he was still once an indy guy, and smarks like to pretend that they are superior by knowing the names of anyone in pool-hall wrestling companies), but they went lukewarm on him. Punk got his love back from the fans only after he cut that shoot promo, and left WWE and bagged Vince (who is hated by most here).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fire Marshall Bill View Post
Uh... yeah they had begun to. I thought this was fairly common knowledge.

Even DB had his detractors around here when he finally won the title. Get popular, the haters will rise. It’s human nature. Doesn’t matter how good you are. It’s one of the reasons the IWC would be the worst bookers in the world.
He was mad about the turn. At Raw 1000 (which off the top of my head is when he turned), he was cheered. People were annoyed he wasn't main eventing. This is literally the first time I've seen anyone suggest this. His crowd reactions would suggest otherwise. He had only been champion for about 5 or 6 months at that point, which isn't long. I do remember people complaining that Ryback should have won (and he should have, he was white hot at the time) but he had to stay champion due to Rock. That I remember. Complaining before that point, I don't.

I think this is a perception rather than reality thing. Or perhaps I'm wrong about this. In which case, where was my head during that time?

DB was a midcard guy when he got the title (unless you are talking about the WWE title and not the World). So that reaction would be understandable.

And Dhenderson, shut up about indy guys. That may help with hardcore fans at first but it doesn't do shit in the long run. Strowman isn't an indy guy. Bryan was and it took him a long time to get going.
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  #37  
Old 03-26-2018, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by therockiswwf View Post
Since Kidd can't do workers' comp nor tort, what would he sue for? Injured workers sue for workers' comp. Kidd can't under law.



If everyone jumped off a cliff, would you do it as well?



I called you out because you called others out. No one else did so I have no reason. Plus I only remembered what you wrote because I responded to that post at the time.

You pointed out her marriage because you thought that was the only reason she had a job.



Reigns was overexposed as in he wasn't fully complete in the ring yet and had a tendency to mess up on the mic. He was put in a spot a bit earlier than he should have been. Too much, too fast.



Nope.



I said that's where the problem STARTED. Do you not read? People liked Reigns before that match. During that match, you can tell there's a something isn't right here reaction by the crowd.



Uh no. I love Fandango. That guy should never ever be near the main event because I'm not an idiot. If anyone had the mic skills of Rock and ring skills of Kurt, the crowd would do whatever the wrestler wanted them too. Rock was good enough that he was able to turn passionate cheers into boos.



So you think the tater tots promo was good? I don't blame Reigns. Vince put him in a position to die.

Rock had a horrid promo once with Austin during the invasion. Rock basically goes you're a poop and you suck. It was awful and way below his standard. Didn't wet myself. Dry as a whistle actually.



No, I want him framed better. That spear he did on Big Show was awesome. He was cheered when he beat Sheamus. So he can be portrayed in a way people like but they rarely do it. Play to his strengths and hide his weaknesses.





He was mad about the turn. At Raw 1000 (which off the top of my head is when he turned), he was cheered. People were annoyed he wasn't main eventing. This is literally the first time I've seen anyone suggest this. His crowd reactions would suggest otherwise. He had only been champion for about 5 or 6 months at that point, which isn't long. I do remember people complaining that Ryback should have won (and he should have, he was white hot at the time) but he had to stay champion due to Rock. That I remember. Complaining before that point, I don't.

I think this is a perception rather than reality thing. Or perhaps I'm wrong about this. In which case, where was my head during that time?

DB was a midcard guy when he got the title (unless you are talking about the WWE title and not the World). So that reaction would be understandable.

And Dhenderson, shut up about indy guys. That may help with hardcore fans at first but it doesn't do shit in the long run. Strowman isn't an indy guy. Bryan was and it took him a long time to get going.

If Kidd can't sue, then how come thirty former employees of wwe are suing Vince at the moment in a class action for concussion sustained in the ring? Weren't they independent contractors as well?

How could Owen's widow threaten to sue WWE for Owen Hart dying, when he was an independent contractor?

If you hire an independent contractor, and they get injured on your property, you can still get sued, because you owe a duty of care to anyone who enters your property, whether they work for you or not.

If these guys can sue, Tyson Kidd can sue too. He might not win, but Vince doesn't want the attention or the publicity a lawsuit would bring.

Reigns will never be "ready" in most people's eyes here, because he is Vince's guy.

BTW, is John Cena "ready" yet for you all to accept, considering how long he has been around? No, didn't think so.

Maybe the fans were booing Orton at "Summerslam", not Roman. Randy tends to draw some heat from some quarters.

Wrestlers can't make you do squat if you CHOSE to not go along with it. What are you, mindless minions? You choose who you like and don't like, based on your own criteria, no matter how good they are on the mike or how they wrestle. No one puts a gun to your head.

"Teetor tots" is no more embarrassing than "Rudy poo candy ass".

So, you want Roman to be a silent bodyguard for another wrestler, running interference and being hired muscle for said wrestler?

With DB, I was talking about the title he won at WMXXX. If he had kept it for a year, instead of getting injured two months later and vacating it, then he would start getting booed as well, since he is no longer an "underdog" who people can relate to. Deep down, fans hate seeing their faves succeed.
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  #38  
Old 04-17-2018, 02:51 PM
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Just saw this now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
If Kidd can't sue, then how come thirty former employees of wwe are suing Vince at the moment in a class action for concussion sustained in the ring? Weren't they independent contractors as well?
Yes. Guess who won that lawsuit? Guess which side had no merit? Also, that's a different type of lawsuit.

Quote:
How could Owen's widow threaten to sue WWE for Owen Hart dying, when he was an independent contractor?
Again, different type of lawsuit.

Quote:
If you hire an independent contractor, and they get injured on your property, you can still get sued, because you owe a duty of care to anyone who enters your property, whether they work for you or not.

If these guys can sue, Tyson Kidd can sue too. He might not win, but Vince doesn't want the attention or the publicity a lawsuit would bring.
Again, different type of lawsuit. Tyson only has a case of workers comp, which independent contractors can't sue for. I don't see why you keep questioning this.

Quote:
Reigns will never be "ready" in most people's eyes here, because he is Vince's guy.

BTW, is John Cena "ready" yet for you all to accept, considering how long he has been around? No, didn't think so.
Have no idea what you mean by the John Cena thing. Strowman is Vince's guy. People love him.

Quote:
Maybe the fans were booing Orton at "Summerslam", not Roman. Randy tends to draw some heat from some quarters.
They weren't booing. They went from cheering to quiet during the match.

Quote:
Wrestlers can't make you do squat if you CHOSE to not go along with it. What are you, mindless minions? You choose who you like and don't like, based on your own criteria, no matter how good they are on the mike or how they wrestle. No one puts a gun to your head.

"Teetor tots" is no more embarrassing than "Rudy poo candy ass".
No idea what the first part is in response too.

No, that promo was death for Roman. No way he could make that work. I don't blame him. I blame Vince for allowing it knowing Roman isn't fully capable on the mic yet.

Quote:
So, you want Roman to be a silent bodyguard for another wrestler, running interference and being hired muscle for said wrestler?
Good lord no. That would be boring.

Quote:
With DB, I was talking about the title he won at WMXXX. If he had kept it for a year, instead of getting injured two months later and vacating it, then he would start getting booed as well, since he is no longer an "underdog" who people can relate to. Deep down, fans hate seeing their faves succeed.
Speculation. People liked Austin. Wasn't booed after he succeeded. You have a very cynical view of people.
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Old 04-18-2018, 02:46 PM
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UncleSav4ge UncleSav4ge is offline
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UncleSav4ge is looking to come up from OCW...
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I can't wait to see Daniel Bryan vs Samoa Joe, hopefully in a No DQ match.
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