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View Poll Results: Gold Medal Ironman - Shawn Michaels (USA) vs Chris Benoit (CAN)
Shawn Michaels 28 40.58%
Chris Benoit 41 59.42%
Voters: 69. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
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  #1  
Old 02-13-2010, 05:05 PM
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Default Gold Medal Ironman Match - Shawn Michaels (USA) vs Chris Benoit (CAN)




GOLD MEDAL MATCH

Shawn Michaels(USA)


vs

Chris Benoit (CAN)



This is the GOLD MEDAL MATCH in the 2010 Wrestlezolympics. This match will be contested under Ironman Match Rules, and is a ONE-HOUR IRONMAN MATCH! The wrestler with the most pinfalls / submissions / count-out / DQ victories in the course of 60-minutes will be declared the winner.

The winner of this match will win the Gold Medal in the Ironman Event. The loser will be awarded the Silver.

The match will open for discussion on Saturday, February 13th and voting will begin on Sunday, February 14th. This is a non-spam thread, so if you decide to post, you must provide reasons why you are backing a particular wrestler. You may vote without posting.

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  #2  
Old 02-13-2010, 05:08 PM
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Shawn. The very first thought that came to my head here is Benoit will not beat Shawn in the end. he might go ahead, he might even dominate most of the match, but Benoit will lose in the end. Benoit is a guy that manages to get closer than anyone else but never being able to win the big one (other than one time). Shawn is at his best on the big stage, and this certainly would be one of those. Shawn wins, but he can barely move afterwards.
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  #3  
Old 02-14-2010, 02:08 AM
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Originally Posted by klunderbunker View Post
Shawn. The very first thought that came to my head here is Benoit will not beat Shawn in the end. he might go ahead, he might even dominate most of the match, but Benoit will lose in the end. Benoit is a guy that manages to get closer than anyone else but never being able to win the big one (other than one time).
By the one time, do you mean Wrestlemania XX - the "Greatest Stage of Them All?" or do you mean Backlash, the following Pay per view, where the exact same match happened. Because either way, Benoit won. Shawn Michaels didn't.

I think people have held onto the whole "Benoit can't win the big one" thing a bit too long. He's won at Wrestlemania. He's won in the Main Event of Wrestlemania. He's defeated Triple H and Shawn Michaels, back-to-back and in single's matches. He's defeated Triple H in an Iron Man match.

Finally, hes undefeated in Iron Man matches. And by undefeated, I mean he's won both. Not won one and tied in the other. So I'm quite sure Chris Benoit can not just handle his own against Shawn Michaels, but he can "win another big one."

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Originally Posted by klunderbunker View Post
Shawn is at his best on the big stage, and this certainly would be one of those.
You say he's at his best on the big stage, but being at your best doesn't mean you're leaving with a victory. He's lost more Wrestlemania matches than he's won. But more so, lets look closer at these wins and losses, shall we? (I'll only keep in his single's matches, and discount the tag ones - since this isn't a tag match, and he wasn't exactly a star in the Rockers.)

Wins:

1. Wrestlemania VIII: Tito Santana: This match was defining for Shawn's singles career, and Tito was an above average single's, mid-card, Wrestler.. about 3 years prior to this match. So while it was a defining moment in HBK's beginning singles career - it was hardly a challenge.

2. Wrestlemania XII: Bret Hart: This, to me, was his greatest victory and to add onto it, it was an Iron Man match. That adds more value in comparison to what we're discussing here. But there was a slight problem with this situation..

Shawn had to go to Overtime, in One Hour, to get a victory. 30 minutes and no pinfalls or scores I can understand - but a full hour? If Shawn Michaels is as great as he's foreseen then he is should be able to capitalize on an older, slower Hitman within an hour.

3. Wrestlemania XIX: Chris Jericho: In his return to Wrestlemania, he defeated the wannabe Shawn Michaels. It was a great match, but this was more of a re-defining moment for Shawn's resurgence of his career.

4. Wrestlemania XXII: Vince McMahon: Do I even have to? Lets just say, if he would've lost to McMahon.. then there shouldn't even be a discussion on whether he deserves to win against Benoit.

5. Wrestlemania XXIV: Ric Flair: Flair was retiring and in a relative "no-win" situation. While I'm sure he could have, the fact remains a 50 year old man took Shawn Michaels to his very limits. Benoit isn't 50, and knows how to do more damage than Flair.

Losses:

1. Wrestlemania IX: Tatanka: Albeit a countout victory, the fact that Shawn Michaels couldn't put away Tatanka, is shameful. What the hell did Tatanka ever even do? An undefeated streak? Sure.. but everyone starts out with one more or less.

2. Wrestlemania X: Razor Ramon: Shawn's first "big moment" in Wrestlemania history.. and he chokes/loses. Nothing more needs to be said.

3. Wrestlemania XI: Diesel: Shawn's first "Main Event moment" in Wrestlemania history.. and he chokes/loses. Nothing more needs to be said.

4. Wrestlemania XIV: Steve Austin: This one I'll be willing to forget, considering HBK fucking tore his back up and still went out to put Austin over. But a loss is a loss, and thats the overall point.

5. Wrestlemania XX: Chris Benoit: The shear fact that Benoit holds a victory over Shawn Michaels in a match, on the greatest stage of them all, speaks volumes for your theory that HBK > Benoit in big stage moments.

6. Wrestlemania XXI: Kurt Angle: Benoit and Angle are very similar in styles and technical abilities. Angle tore Shawn apart, and at the end of the match Michaels was lucky to have only lost.

7. Wrestlemania XXIII: John Cena: Cena was the bigger name, and Shawn couldn't out-do that in another big moment loss.

8. Wrestlemania XXV: The Undertaker: See Cena reference.

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Shawn wins, but he can barely move afterwards.
On the otherhand.. Shawn loses.. and should lose, by a large number.
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  #4  
Old 02-13-2010, 05:11 PM
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I have to wonder two things:

1) Shawn had a WAR with Kobashi, that he narrowly escaped, and then eeked by Rocky Maivia.

2) Benoit beat Pat O'Connor pretty handilly, and then dispatched El Santo.

Seems Shawn has had a tougher road and may be more fatigued. He only gets 48 hours between matches.

Also, the Wrestlezolympics do take place IN CANADA, where Shawn is hated and Benoit was one revered. Will home-field make a difference?
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  #5  
Old 02-13-2010, 05:14 PM
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Regarding the Canada thing, I'd point out Survivor Series 97. All shenanigans aside, Shawn was booked over Bret Hart, who is light years ahead of Benoit in national importance. Also, yeah Benoit had an easier route, but he was still going for the same amount of time. It's not like he was doing nothing at all. Shawn will be in a coma after it, but he'll win.
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  #6  
Old 02-13-2010, 05:16 PM
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Point 1.

Both men are perfect in Iron Man Matches. There are major differences. This is a 60 man Iron Match. In Benoit's two iron man matches, one was a 60 man Iron Match. He was able to get two pinfalls in that match. Shawn Michaels was able to get 0 in his. Furthermore, In his other Iron man match, He was able to get 4 wins in just over 30 minutes. I feel Shawn Michaels might not be able to get a pinfall in the alloted time, while Benoit could.
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Old 02-15-2010, 05:21 AM
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Shawn is, simply put, the better of the 2. I put Benoit in my Top 5 wrestlers, so in no way will I underestimate his ability to give Shawn a very tough challenge here. However, Shawn is a better wrestler. Benoit defeated Triple H, but Shawn Michaels defeated Bret Hart. Both are tough competitors, and this would be one of the closest, most interesting matches in the business. That being said, Benoit has never been as big as Shawn. I can't put Benoit over here. Not because he's not great, but because Shawn is greater.

The home field advantage has been used, however, it really doesn't matter as much as you like to say it does. Shawn was booked to go over Bret Hart in Canada. If he can go over Hart, do you think Benoit is anywhere near the hero he is? It's not even close.


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Originally Posted by TheOneBigWill View Post
He's defeated Triple H and Shawn Michaels, back-to-back and in single's matches.
Would anyone like to tell me why Shawn lost his singles match with Benoit? I mean, we all know he was about to pin Benoit and win. Ah yeah I remember, an interference. There'll be no Triple H to save Benoit's ass in this match.

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Originally Posted by Mr. TM View Post
In Benoit's two iron man matches, one was a 60 man Iron Match. He was able to get two pinfalls in that match. Shawn Michaels was able to get 0 in his.
Shall I spin this around? I like doing that. Benoit was pinned 3 times in 60 minutes. In OVER 60 minutes, how many times was Shawn pinned? 0. By a wrestler who's at the very least of the same calibre of Benoit's, and some would argue Hart is actually even better than Benoit. If Hart can't get just 1 pin, I doubt Benoit would get enough to defeat Shawn. Now, I'm not saying Benoit will get 0 pins, but he'll get less than Shawn.
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  #8  
Old 02-15-2010, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by HBK-aholic View Post
Shawn is, simply put, the better of the 2. I put Benoit in my Top 5 wrestlers, so in no way will I underestimate his ability to give Shawn a very tough challenge here. However, Shawn is a better wrestler. Benoit defeated Triple H, but Shawn Michaels defeated Bret Hart. Both are tough competitors, and this would be one of the closest, most interesting matches in the business. That being said, Benoit has never been as big as Shawn. I can't put Benoit over here. Not because he's not great, but because Shawn is greater.

The home field advantage has been used, however, it really doesn't matter as much as you like to say it does. Shawn was booked to go over Bret Hart in Canada. If he can go over Hart, do you think Benoit is anywhere near the hero he is? It's not even close.




Would anyone like to tell me why Shawn lost his singles match with Benoit? I mean, we all know he was about to pin Benoit and win. Ah yeah I remember, an interference. There'll be no Triple H to save Benoit's ass in this match.



Shall I spin this around? I like doing that. Benoit was pinned 3 times in 60 minutes. In OVER 60 minutes, how many times was Shawn pinned? 0. By a wrestler who's at the very least of the same calibre of Benoit's, and some would argue Hart is actually even better than Benoit. If Hart can't get just 1 pin, I doubt Benoit would get enough to defeat Shawn. Now, I'm not saying Benoit will get 0 pins, but he'll get less than Shawn.
1. How about that triple threat match at Backlash 2004. I remember Benoit making your boyfriend HBK tap out. He could do the same thing against and he has the Sharpshooter, Croosface, and the diving headbutt as ways to pin HBK.

2. The likelihood of Michaels losing a pin is much greater than him getting a pin. Benoit has gotten pinfalls in Iron Man Matches against wrestlers who wrestle similar to Hart in Angle and HHH.

3. It doesn't matter that Benoit has never been bigger than Shawn. That could have matter if HBK had actually beat Benoit before but he hasn't.
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Old 02-15-2010, 06:25 AM
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1. How about that triple threat match at Backlash 2004. I remember Benoit making your boyfriend HBK tap out.
We got married yesterday, actually, he's my husband now. Shall I show why using Triple Threat matches usually isn't a valid argument? Wrestler A and B could beat the shit out of each other, while Wrestler C could stay out of it for the most part. After a while of A and B getting tired and injured, wrestler C could come out of no where and gain a pin. Say Wrestler A is Austin, Wrestler B is Hogan and Wrestler C is Shelton Benjamin. Would Benjamin be a better wrestler than Austin and Hogan in this case? Of course not, which is why Triple threat matches aren't a reliable way of seeing who would win a singles match.

Quote:
He could do the same thing against and he has the Sharpshooter, Croosface, and the diving headbutt as ways to pin HBK.
Shawn has also used the Sharpshooter, Crossface, AND has his own set of moves, such as Sweet chin Music which he can hit in a second. Both have wide movesets so it's not really an argument for or against either.

Quote:
2. The likelihood of Michaels losing a pin is much greater than him getting a pin. Benoit has gotten pinfalls in Iron Man Matches against wrestlers who wrestle similar to Hart in Angle and HHH.
First of all, on what planet does Hart wrestle the same as Triple H? Do you not watch wrestling? Second of all, Shwan has pinfalls over both, so again, this is kind of a stupid point.

However, both have had just over 90 minutes worth of Iron Man Matches. Shawn was pinned twice in those 90 minutes, Benoit was pinned 8 times, and Shawn's main competitor of Hart is a better wrestler than Benoits main competitor of Triple H.

Quote:
3. It doesn't matter that Benoit has never been bigger than Shawn. That could have matter if HBK had actually beat Benoit before but he hasn't.
Hon the only thing bringing up the Shawn/Benoit match does is make it obvious Benoit can only beat Shawn when Triple H interferes. Go watch the match again, Shawn had just kicked SCM and Triple H had to interfere or Shawn would have won.
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Old 02-15-2010, 06:40 AM
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We got married yesterday, actually, he's my husband now. Shall I show why using Triple Threat matches usually isn't a valid argument? Wrestler A and B could beat the shit out of each other, while Wrestler C could stay out of it for the most part. After a while of A and B getting tired and injured, wrestler C could come out of no where and gain a pin. Say Wrestler A is Austin, Wrestler B is Hogan and Wrestler C is Shelton Benjamin. Would Benjamin be a better wrestler than Austin and Hogan in this case? Of course not, which is why Triple threat matches aren't a reliable way of seeing who would win a singles match.

Shawn has also used the Sharpshooter, Crossface, AND has his own set of moves, such as Sweet chin Music which he can hit in a second. Both have wide movesets so it's not really an argument for or against either.

First of all, on what planet does Hart wrestle the same as Triple H? Do you not watch wrestling? Second of all, Shwan has pinfalls over both, so again, this is kind of a stupid point.

However, both have had just over 90 minutes worth of Iron Man Matches. Shawn was pinned twice in those 90 minutes, Benoit was pinned 8 times, and Shawn's main competitor of Hart is a better wrestler than Benoits main competitor of Triple H.

Hon the only thing bringing up the Shawn/Benoit match does is make it obvious Benoit can only beat Shawn when Triple H interferes. Go watch the match again, Shawn had just kicked SCM and Triple H had to interfere or Shawn would have won.
1. I've watched the match and he did hit SCM but you can only speculate as to whether he would have won. Maybe he would have or maybe he wouldn't. People have kicked out of SCM before.

2. I always love the "do you not watch wrestling" schtick when I have you on the run. HHH and Angle work a technical style similar to Hart even though HHH doesn't have a submission finisher. They usually target a body part to set up a finishing move (Angle at least). HHH has more victories over than HBK than the other way around

3. When is the last time HBK has won with the crossfacce? We all know the last time HBK has won with the Sharpshooter and I don't see McMahon ordering the bell to ring.

4. You would think HBK being so great that he would have gotten a pinfall off of Hart in 60 minutes. HBK can't run forever and Benoit may use the first half hour just to wear him down and then he can get the pinfalls from there.

I'm thinking Benoit wins 3-2.
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