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  #1  
Old 04-22-2017, 08:59 PM
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Default Shibata Injury and State of NJPW

I'll post links at the end of the bottom of my post

So after the 5 star match Shibata and Okada put on a few weeks back, Other than Dave Meltzer and other outlets no one is talking about the aftermath of the match. In case you haven't heard Shibata had suffered a subdural hematoma —a burst blood vessel and pooling of blood in the bran from the wicked Headbutt he gave to Okada which legit busted Shibata open the hard way. After the match he collapsed after the match back stage and was rushed to the hospital...we now find out that he suffered paralysis and memory loss and due to doctors concern this could spell the end of Shibata's career. Dave Meltzer is noted on saying that that headbutt spot should and could of been changed resulting in no change in his grade of the match.

My heart goes out to Shibata because of his work and effort he gave. He Left the company to pursue a MMA career when he was in line to be one of the ACE's on NJPW came back and worked his way up to the main event and its such a same to have him go out like this because it seemed like it was finally gonna be his year at maybe getting the title.

Now the second part of my post is a 2 parted first:What now for New Japan...as you know of if you don't NJPW books their events for the whole year not week by week or a Old mans wimp. Shibata seemed to have another fued with Suzuki and Suzuki-Gun,a rematch with Goto and a top 4 in G1 Climax the question is now if his career is done who replaces him for Kenny Omega this might seem good because this would cement his place as Foreign ACE,Does Tanahashi re-try for the title, Does Goto take over for Shibata or do with get a New star.?

Second: Again with have another career cut short due to head injury, We know that the Strong/Shoot Style in popular but will this halt the progress and have promotions and wrestlers thinking of using a new style. Will this cause promotions to Ban more moves and strikes?

Thank for reading and if in the wrong place I will add to correct forum.

http://fightland.vice.com/blog/katsu...tyle-wrestling

http://deadspin.com/katsuyori-shibat...ing-1794532912

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8pLHpTgQ6E
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  #2  
Old 04-22-2017, 11:34 PM
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I've read about it and am pretty sad about it.

Shibata getting injured was unfortunate but you can't neglect his style of wrestling. The hard hitting matches are awesome but the competitors have to suffer because of it. The injury Shibata suffered is actually very serious and I think that this should stop or done to a lesser degree.

A hard hitting match once in a while isn't bad but having such matches continuously does affect the wrestler and that's very wrong.
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Old 04-23-2017, 12:05 AM
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He's responsible for one of my favorite matches of this year with Riddle. They had a great bout over the RevPro British Heavyweight Title. Haven't seen nearly anyone online or my personal friends talk about it, but it really was a great one. A lot of hard hitting strikes, and I think there is only one spot where they exit the ring for less than a ten count. Lot's of mat based grapling, Strikes, and the highspots are basically just brutal suplexes and slams. Ends with a great show of respect from Riddle and makes it feel super important as Zack comes out after to stare down, and as he leaves Shibata lays the title down in front of him and sits. Also had pretty good matches with Ospreay & Sabre Jr. for the same belt. Then he had this work of art with Okada. Also had great matches with Bad Luck Fale, Suzuki, Goto and a few others within the last 4 months.

Great pro-wrestler and guy with a solid book of work to look back on and be praised for. The only thing is with all the passion, and work he put in the time passes a lot more harsh on him. 37 for any active pro-wrestler can be an entire different world from where they were even 2-3 years ago. It was eventually going to happen, and a match where he pushes it like this doesn't surprise me. I'd love to see him around, but I have no idea if anyone would clear him. A lot of these guys can function more than fine, but there is that risk looming over their heads in the future. The Shibatas and D. Bryans are more of a danger to themselves than their opponents in nearly all circumstance. A lot of these guys are their own worst enemy and it is not limited to just the guys who are jerks in the back or the druggies. Every part of their life needs to be in moderation, and it's easy to get lost in the mix and get ahead of yourself just once and then something happens. Already sent my love to Shibata & his team when the news initially broke. Respect & Love Meltzer, but there was no way it was a work this time.


NJPW will be fine. They've consistently progressed and overcome financial, booking, and media obstacles. So I don't think his career is essentially over, but he is going to be off for a while. They lay out a lot of their booking way in advance, yes. Luckily a lot of the Japan tours had a lack of U.S. / North American talent and a few Euro. Guys were cut to. They'll either call or Get __x__ top guy and have him replace Shibata for the foreseeable and then work out something as the smoke clears and they learn more on the extent of his condition. Not sure what it'd be, but NJPW isn't really a company to fantasy / pretend book for. Some of their in ring storytelling for 3/4 Star matches is better than entire weeks revolving around WWE's most praised PPV matches.

Rev. Pro banning? Nah. Evolve? Nah. WCPW? LolNo. NJPW? Maybe, but only because they actually have a platform that sets them above the *Indie* level to anyone who isn't completely brain dead. I think they might get to the point where we might see how peak Styles is now in WWE in places like ROH or NJPW. Also allowing moves to only __x__ Pro-wrestler and actually taking more things into consideration. It's a hard balance between Wrasslin and Sports Entertainment one has to find. Overall most of their competitors aren't doing this stuff Shibata, Omega, Okada, etc are doing. That being said all of their top guys, and people who actually draw quite a bit of money should probably be more advised considering this is at least the 2nd A level injury to happen in NJPW just this year.
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Old 04-23-2017, 05:59 AM
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I was there live and the sound the headbutt made was pretty nasty... I loved the match, one of Shibata's best. I think he will return but if he doesn't then he can say he finished with a 5 star match.

Personally I believe after Shibata losing to Okada, he would've feuded with Naito and eventually beat him for the IC belt. After that who knows, maybe a Sanada feud or something. But New Japan should be fine, if it's one thing they have more than enough of, it's singles heavyweights.

I don't think stylewise anything will change. Ishii has always done headbutts but they were always done to the chest/neck area.
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Old 04-23-2017, 02:11 PM
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This and other similar situations always make me think about the first Talking Smack confrontation between Miz and Daniel Bryan in which Bryan refers to Miz as a "coward" or someone who was always worried about getting hurt; Miz went off and delivered his best work on the mic, best because not only was it not scripted but you also got a sense that he was unloading some frustration over comments that some fans and wrestlers have said about him over the past decade. One of Miz's responses was that he didn't do a lot of the high risk stuff, that he was careful, and that because of that he'd never been injured in over a decade in WWE, that he was still healthy and actually able to wrestle. As much as I love Daniel Bryan, I found myself siding with Miz because I always thought the whole point of pro wrestling was putting on a show, to make it appear as though you're hurting someone rather than legitimately hurting someone and that's the problem with Strong Style as it's not a question of if but rather a question of when someone is going to get hurt and get hurt bad.

Recently, the Revival worked one of their last NXT house shows in a tag match against Shinsuke Nakamura, I can't remember who Nakamura's partner was off the top of my head, and Nakamura delivered the Kinshasa to Dash Wilder, broke his jaw and Wilder's expected to be out for 2 months, thereby keeping Dawson out for 2 months as well right when they're just getting things going after a couple of strong wins over New Day. Injuries can happen at any given time, but it just seems like the Strong Style is a disaster waiting to happen and it's easy to see why most American companies shy away from it. WWE is most especially going to keep shying away from it because Strong Style is some sort of lawsuit waiting pounce. It's entirely possible, ENTIRELY possible to put on a hard hitting, physical match, wrestlers have to be very selective as to where they hit, however. Fans respond to the loud smack anyhow, so go after the chest, the stomach, the back, etc. If you do a legit headbutt, if you purposely strike in the head or face enough times with a knee or forearm then something is eventually going to go wrong.

EDIT - Shibata updated his condition via his blog earlier today stating that the right side of his body was still handicapped, that he's scheduled for another surgery next month and that he wants to return to wrestling.
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  #6  
Old 04-28-2017, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Jack-Hammer View Post
One of Miz's responses was that he didn't do a lot of the high risk stuff, that he was careful, and that because of that he'd never been injured in over a decade in WWE, that he was still healthy and actually able to wrestle. As much as I love Daniel Bryan, I found myself siding with Miz because I always thought the whole point of pro wrestling was putting on a show, to make it appear as though you're hurting someone rather than legitimately hurting someone and that's the problem with Strong Style as it's not a question of if but rather a question of when someone is going to get hurt and get hurt bad.
Quality or quantity I suppose. Bryan can't wrestle now but he always had better matches than Miz, and was more over than he ever will be. So I suppose for the fans Strong Style is good but for the wrestlers themselves not so much...

Hiromu Takahashi is my favourite cruiserweight currently because his style is so unique and completely suicidal. The way he wrestles, I can't imagine him having a long career. But he is no doubt aware of this. Shibata was too. Would these two have been as successful if they didn't wrestle like that? They needed sacrifice for success.

Ultimately for me it helps the suspension of disbelief... There's nothing like hitting each other than... Actually hitting each other. Brawling in WWE is boring and a chore to watch because it looks so fake. In New Japan it is so much more enthralling. Shibata vs Okada was a 40 minute match revolving around brawling and strikes and was incredible. There's no way a match like that in a WWE ring could hold my attention for long. But both wrestlers would probably come out of it unscathed and could wrestle again the next day or the next week. Quantity and quality.

Anyway it seems New Japan won't be changing its ways if last night was any indication. Goto took a full unprotected chair shot to the head.
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Old 04-30-2017, 12:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ヒュー G. レックション View Post
Quality or quantity I suppose. Bryan can't wrestle now but he always had better matches than Miz, and was more over than he ever will be. So I suppose for the fans Strong Style is good but for the wrestlers themselves not so much...

Hiromu Takahashi is my favourite cruiserweight currently because his style is so unique and completely suicidal. The way he wrestles, I can't imagine him having a long career. But he is no doubt aware of this. Shibata was too. Would these two have been as successful if they didn't wrestle like that? They needed sacrifice for success.

Ultimately for me it helps the suspension of disbelief... There's nothing like hitting each other than... Actually hitting each other. Brawling in WWE is boring and a chore to watch because it looks so fake. In New Japan it is so much more enthralling. Shibata vs Okada was a 40 minute match revolving around brawling and strikes and was incredible. There's no way a match like that in a WWE ring could hold my attention for long. But both wrestlers would probably come out of it unscathed and could wrestle again the next day or the next week. Quantity and quality.

Anyway it seems New Japan won't be changing its ways if last night was any indication. Goto took a full unprotected chair shot to the head.
I agree that hard hitting brawls are good to watch. But the suffering by wrestlers just doesn't make it up for the good matches. Like a full unprotected chair shot to the head should be avoided.

The "Strong Style" shouldn't be used to such a great extent. Have it up for just big events and it'll make it even more special. That's what I think about it. I don't think that "Strong Style" justifies such fatal injuries like the one to Shibata.
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Old 05-01-2017, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ヒュー G. レックション View Post
Quality or quantity I suppose. Bryan can't wrestle now but he always had better matches than Miz, and was more over than he ever will be. So I suppose for the fans Strong Style is good but for the wrestlers themselves not so much...

Hiromu Takahashi is my favourite cruiserweight currently because his style is so unique and completely suicidal. The way he wrestles, I can't imagine him having a long career. But he is no doubt aware of this. Shibata was too. Would these two have been as successful if they didn't wrestle like that? They needed sacrifice for success.

Ultimately for me it helps the suspension of disbelief... There's nothing like hitting each other than... Actually hitting each other. Brawling in WWE is boring and a chore to watch because it looks so fake. In New Japan it is so much more enthralling. Shibata vs Okada was a 40 minute match revolving around brawling and strikes and was incredible. There's no way a match like that in a WWE ring could hold my attention for long. But both wrestlers would probably come out of it unscathed and could wrestle again the next day or the next week. Quantity and quality.

Anyway it seems New Japan won't be changing its ways if last night was any indication. Goto took a full unprotected chair shot to the head.
I think you are looking at it wrong. It is not quality vs quantity but quality of life vs wheelchair. Athletes need to be protected from themselves. Athletes will run themselves through a brick wall if allowed. Humans are not supposed to take that kind of long-term damage. The body will eventually breakdown if they continue to do a stiff style. They might not be aware of how much damage they are doing to themselves and how much trouble they will have later in life. Athletes can be short-sighted. Despite WWE's best efforts, wrestlers still end up in pain after they retire.

Daniel Bryan tried to fight his multiple concussion diagnosis. His wife had to talk him out of leaving WWE and wrestling again. He also had to be talked into revealing his concussion that led to him retiring. Bryan had to be protected from himself. NJPW needs to learn that. Being tough and fighting through things is dumb. There is a difference between fighting through bruises and fighting through injuries/destroying your body.

Bret Hart always complained about moves like the knife edge chops. Reason being they actually hurt. Bret said people forgot wrestling is only supposed to look like it hurts. It is not supposed to actually hurt. That is not to say wrestling does not hurt. He meant it as they should keep moves that do hurt to a minimum.
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