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  #11  
Old 02-04-2017, 09:43 AM
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For me, the main problem as always be the fact that they condition the fans to not think of NXT as a developmental brand. So every couple of months they get these takeover matches with some great in-ring matches featuring the best indy workers in thd world and the rest of the time they get almost nothing because they have to give time to the new guys that are there to learn and become better superstar. I'm all for having the nakamura's and bobby roode's type of superstars as part of nxt, but they shouldn't be ghe focus of the brand, they should be their to give the rub to the younger guys and help them out in looking like they belong as a main event program, just like what they should do on the main roster with guys like, cena, orton, aj styles and the part timers. That's how you create new stars and of all peoples HHH should know that but it seem like he's a stubborn as vince on this and would rather sign big name guys then actually try to make some.
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  #12  
Old 02-04-2017, 11:46 AM
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It's not new any more. You've seen it and felt it and it either has to change, adapt or die. Plus it's not yours anymore, many of the things and people that you have loved have been elevated to another level and you've lost that ownership you felt. So it is no longer special.

Plus the lack of talent. But really if you look at what people were saying about Takeover: San Antonio, it sounds like they put on a very good to terrific show that just lacked a marquee match or moment that you can focus your opinions on.

I don't know, I don't watch it.
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  #13  
Old 02-05-2017, 03:24 PM
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There is nothing "wrong" with NXT. The intention and vision behind NXT is that despite how much we as loyal fans enjoy the product, it is still a developmental brand. Its purpose is creating new stars to send up to Raw or Smackdown. The good thing about this is that it gives us a bit of a revolving door of talent. It is always evolving and changing. The bad thing about this, is that it sometimes causes times where growth is needed. NXT has been in such a season ever since the return of the Brand Extension last summer cost them so many stars. This is a GOOD thing. The main roster needed them more than NXT did. Look at what good that did, especially for Smackdown. They just need to focus on making new stars who will then be prepared for main roster promotions, and then the cycle continues. That "problem" is not going anyway anytime soon, and I have to use that term of "problem" loosely because it truly isn't a problem at all when you think about it.
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  #14  
Old 03-31-2017, 05:23 PM
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i think that another problem with NXT is that some guys are staying way too long on the NXT roster which doesn'T help them at all when they finally get the call up. A look at it as the WWEECW syndrome. Right now, these guys and girls are big fish in a small pound and the more they look like superstar on the brand, the more they look like midcard guys by the time they get to the main roster.

Personally, i think guys like nakamura, roode, balor, joe and most of the other indy guys should come in, learn how the wwe style work and move to the main roster within half a year. You don'T over expose them on NXT, they are background guys, that way they don'T have the NXT main event label stuck to them and when they come up to the main roster, it feel like a bigger deal that these guys are in WWE instead of looking like guys that we're stuck in developmental for over a year.

Also if a guy like tye dillinger has been in wwe before getting sign for NXT, don't bring it up on tv because the worst thing you can do for a character is showing how he fail the first time around, as soon as i realise that tye was on the ECW roster before been in NXT, it made me realise how much of a nobody he was and how the guy will fail on the main roster. That not helping the guy at all, in fact it's hurting him.

I think NXT shouldn't be the third brand of WWE, That why ECW failed the last time around and it didn'T help anybody on that roster. It should have remind a developpemental territory instead of a touring brand with big shows every four months.
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  #15  
Old 04-01-2017, 06:32 AM
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After the last set of call ups, I honestly thought NXT would die due to lack of star power. However, they've built it back up and that is awesome to see.

One problem I think is that they have so few titles for how many people they have on the roster. I think NXT needs a mid-card title. There are a lot of guys on NXT that don't quite fit in the main event picture but are good enough to get air time and sustain a storyline. However, having a mid-card title gives them experience as a champion and thus, they can jump to the main roster without having had to have been in the NXT title picture. Look at a guy like Apollo Crews for example. If there was say an NXT Intercontinental title and he had held it, he could have had some meaningful feuds in NXT and had a run as a champion then been put right into the midcard picture on the main roster.

The point of NXT is development. Having guys be a midcard champion, even if it's not the main event or main belt, helps them to learn how to be in a feud for a championship, chase the championship, defend it, etc.
Plus, it makes it more interesting to the fans.
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  #16  
Old 04-01-2017, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by wrestlingmasters55 View Post
i think that another problem with NXT is that some guys are staying way too long on the NXT roster which doesn'T help them at all when they finally get the call up. A look at it as the WWEECW syndrome. Right now, these guys and girls are big fish in a small pound and the more they look like superstar on the brand, the more they look like midcard guys by the time they get to the main roster.
I see the point you are trying to make here, though I do not necessarily agree. They should remain in NXT until the main roster needs them. You don't want the rosters on Raw and Smackdown to get too clogged up. Raw has already reached that point and even some of the Smackdown guys seem lost in the shuffle. They have built NXT up as such a great brand in its own right so even though it truly is still the developmental show in the vision behind it, being in NXT is not a bad thing. If someone is a star in NXT then it makes it all the better when they make it to the main roster. Enzo and Cass for example were in NXT for a really long time (perhaps "too long" by your theory) and it made it better when they got to Raw.


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Originally Posted by wrestlingmasters55 View Post
Personally, i think guys like nakamura, roode, balor, joe and most of the other indy guys should come in, learn how the wwe style work and move to the main roster within half a year. You don'T over expose them on NXT, they are background guys, that way they don'T have the NXT main event label stuck to them and when they come up to the main roster, it feel like a bigger deal that these guys are in WWE instead of looking like guys that we're stuck in developmental for over a year.
As I already stated in the above paragraph, they are not getting overexposed. They are better off being stars in NXT until the main roster does need them. Being on the main roster but having nothing to do there at all kind of defeats the purpose. If they are in NXT making a bigger name for themselves then it creates a bigger impact when they get promoted and placed into a role where they will thrive. Plus, there is another side of this same coin. NXT needs top stars too. Say they lost all their top tier talent to main roster promotions just for the sake of moving up those who are "ready". Ok so there goes Roode, Nakamura, Tye, Asuka, Ember Moon, The Revival and DIY. Now you have no contenders for the titles. The rest are still in training. Sure it is developmental, but it helps to have believable champions that are being challenged by believable contenders. Therefore you should keep that in mind too.


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Also if a guy like tye dillinger has been in wwe before getting sign for NXT, don't bring it up on tv because the worst thing you can do for a character is showing how he fail the first time around, as soon as i realise that tye was on the ECW roster before been in NXT, it made me realise how much of a nobody he was and how the guy will fail on the main roster. That not helping the guy at all, in fact it's hurting him.
I disagree here too. That helped Tye in the sense that it showed how much he has improved. Back then he sucked and it didn't help that they put no effort into his push. In fact, it was so bad that I genuinely had no idea Tye was that same guy until the promo where it was addressed. Now Tye has a cool gimmick that will help him out a great deal. It also shows how the NXT system is lightyears ahead of what WWE tried to turn the ECW brand into. Never in their wildest dreams (or for us as fans) could they have thought it would grow something as big and popular as it has. That promo showed not only how Tye has improved but how WWE's training process has improved. I liked it.


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I think NXT shouldn't be the third brand of WWE, That why ECW failed the last time around and it didn'T help anybody on that roster. It should have remind a developpemental territory instead of a touring brand with big shows every four months.
It's not the third brand in the sense that WWE's ECW was. The reason WWE's ECW failed is because they were never going to give it the treatment it deserved. Vince won against WCW and the real ECW so naturally he would want to present his brand as superior to those he defeated. Why would he want to allow brands that weren't his to be seen as a potentially bigger deal? I'm not quite supporting why he and his team did what they did, however I see the reasons for why they may have wanted to go the route they did. WWE's ECW was never going to be successful. It was set up for failure. Then it got more interesting when it got turned into a bit of a training brand without actually being one. The Talent Initiative saw guys like Evan Bourne and Jack Swagger who went on to see decent success, but it also gave us guys who SUCKED like Ricky Ortiz with his rally towels and the infamous Braden Walker. They weren't really given much to work with since it was "the third brand". Imagine a group of friends hanging out. Raw is the guy who has been there from the start. Smackdown is the guy who came shortly after but fit right in. WWE's ECW is the awkward third wheel who came later and wanted to join in on the fun but just never fit in with what the other two were doing. Now we have that same analogy but with NXT instead. NXT is the guy who was a big deal elsewhere but is rumored to be coming soon, and everyone wants to see how he will fit into their group when he comes. Unlike WWE's ECW his joining is anticipated because the few times he does show up to their hangouts (NXT doing the Big 4 weekends with Raw/Smackdown) he makes an impact.

In other words, WWE knows EXACTLY what they are doing with NXT. It is not a "third brand" for the main roster. It is a developmental show that has become its own entity, but still maintains its original vision by being a path to bring talent to Raw or Smackdown.



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After the last set of call ups, I honestly thought NXT would die due to lack of star power. However, they've built it back up and that is awesome to see.
I thought the same thing. It is coming along though. So long as either Roode or Nakamura stay for the men and Ember Moon is there to fill the void Asuka will leave, they should be fine. Oddly enough the tag team division is probably the division in the best condition looking forward. The whole point of NXT is to build up stars anyway, so I expect they will recover by August. Have Ember feud with Kay and Royce over the summer to rebuild the women's division. They'll need to build up some more contenders for whoever wins Nakamura VS Roode tonight, other than that I am not concerned. NXT is a brand that I would never be worried about due how good they are at making something good out of simple storylines and training the talent.


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One problem I think is that they have so few titles for how many people they have on the roster. I think NXT needs a mid-card title. There are a lot of guys on NXT that don't quite fit in the main event picture but are good enough to get air time and sustain a storyline. However, having a mid-card title gives them experience as a champion and thus, they can jump to the main roster without having had to have been in the NXT title picture. Look at a guy like Apollo Crews for example. If there was say an NXT Intercontinental title and he had held it, he could have had some meaningful feuds in NXT and had a run as a champion then been put right into the midcard picture on the main roster.

The point of NXT is development. Having guys be a midcard champion, even if it's not the main event or main belt, helps them to learn how to be in a feud for a championship, chase the championship, defend it, etc.
Plus, it makes it more interesting to the fans.
I disagree. NXT from a year ago at this time, maybe. Look at NXT right now though. Who would benefit from a midcard title? There are no top male stars at all other than Roode and Nakamura. Do you want to create a title for guys like Andrade Almas or No Way Jose? Sorry but they are not good enough for a title. Even amongst the women you have the top tier in Asuka and Ember then you have Kay and Royce who are improving but still not quite at that level, and then all the rest are nowhere near ready for a title shot. NXT does not need a midcard title or any new titles for that matter. I've liked that the UK Championship has been up for grabs there, though it will need its own show to launch soon. There's no reason to add another title when they need to be building up stars instead.
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  #17  
Old 09-14-2017, 10:27 AM
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Something that i just realise after watching NXT last night is how much of a uphill battle these guys in NXT have to overcome when they get called up. I Might have wrote about this before but why not write it again. How can a NXT wrestler especially those that don't have indy experience grow as a performer and create a good heel or babyface persona if the crowd are always cheering for everybody.

I was watching the wolfgang vs peter dunn match last night. Pete dunn is suppose to be the Heel in this match but he got cheered more then the babyface wolfgang. So if they decide someday to called up Peter dunn, how can he adapt to the main roster if all he knows is that even as a heel, he's getting cheered. And that's not just for this guy, it happens to pretty much every heel on the NXT roster, then they get called up to the main roster with a bigger casual fanbase and they get lost because they couldn't feed from the crowd responds during the time they we're on NXT.

While i love the fact that the NXT crowd is a passionate about the product and it's more of a indy crowd then the main roster, i still think that they are doing the wrestler a disservice by allowing the fans to react how they want. That why a lot of those guys have problem adapting to the main roster when they get called up because the training staff aren't teaching them how to get the fans to react the way they want to react and they let the fans do what they want. A great heel is somebody that knows how to make the fans believe he's a heel and get them to boo him even if they don't want to.

Kevin Owens is the perfect exemple of a guy that fans loves but can get them to boo him anyway. That's how good he his. If you compare that to Bobby Roode, who during his whole NXT run was suppose to be a heel yet, he was getting cheered everytime mostly because of the theme song. That's why the made him a babyface on smackdown and seem like they really don't have any plan for him as of now because while really talented and experience, he's just another bland character that came out of the indy factory we call NXT.
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Old 09-14-2017, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by wrestlingmasters55 View Post
Something that i just realise after watching NXT last night is how much of a uphill battle these guys in NXT have to overcome when they get called up. I Might have wrote about this before but why not write it again. How can a NXT wrestler especially those that don't have indy experience grow as a performer and create a good heel or babyface persona if the crowd are always cheering for everybody.

I was watching the wolfgang vs peter dunn match last night. Pete dunn is suppose to be the Heel in this match but he got cheered more then the babyface wolfgang. So if they decide someday to called up Peter dunn, how can he adapt to the main roster if all he knows is that even as a heel, he's getting cheered. And that's not just for this guy, it happens to pretty much every heel on the NXT roster, then they get called up to the main roster with a bigger casual fanbase and they get lost because they couldn't feed from the crowd responds during the time they we're on NXT.

While i love the fact that the NXT crowd is a passionate about the product and it's more of a indy crowd then the main roster, i still think that they are doing the wrestler a disservice by allowing the fans to react how they want. That why a lot of those guys have problem adapting to the main roster when they get called up because the training staff aren't teaching them how to get the fans to react the way they want to react and they let the fans do what they want. A great heel is somebody that knows how to make the fans believe he's a heel and get them to boo him even if they don't want to.

Kevin Owens is the perfect exemple of a guy that fans loves but can get them to boo him anyway. That's how good he his. If you compare that to Bobby Roode, who during his whole NXT run was suppose to be a heel yet, he was getting cheered everytime mostly because of the theme song. That's why the made him a babyface on smackdown and seem like they really don't have any plan for him as of now because while really talented and experience, he's just another bland character that came out of the indy factory we call NXT.
In the modern age, fans are going to cheer and boo for whoever they want, often regardless of whatever direction a company tries to steer a wrestler in. Kevin Owens beat up a 72 year old man Tuesday night on SmackDown Live and many of the fans still cheered him just like they always do. On NXT, Pete Dunne left Wolfgang for dead, metaphorically, after Wolfgang came to his aid when the Undisputed were beating the crap out of him; Dunne ran back to the ring not to help but to retrieve his championship rather than help a guy who helped him. That's a very heelish thing to do, the guy looked like a lowlife but a lot of the fans still cheered him. What's he supposed to do? punt kick a puppy with three legs, one eye and no nuts into the crowd? Hell, even if he did, some would still cheer him. Braun Strowman beats up babyfaces all the time, but he gets cheered by a sizeable portion of the fans, partially because of who he beats up as booing guys like Reigns and Cena and they see it as some sort of bullshit rebellion. In NXT, guys like Roderick Strong and Johnny Gargano partially because they're indie guys, they're guys who some fans feel who earned notoriety before they were part of "the machine"; they're talented wrestlers but the fact that they spent their entire careers on the indie scene gives them a leg up with the number of modern fans who let dirt sheet writers tell them what they should think is good instead of forming their own opinion: indie scene is good, big corporate machine is bad.

As I said in a post in the thread suggesting that Strowman be turned face, being labeled a babyface or a heel is pretty much irrelevant in this day and age. Kayfabe is essentially dead and there's no way around it, there hasn't been much of a way around it for the better part of two decades; it's been in a coma on life support due to the internet but what really came along and pulled the plug is social media. People can now not only find out the ins and out afforded them by peeking behind the curtain via the internet, they can now do it anywhere at anytime thanks to phones and tablets.

What wrestling companies have to worry about more is when someone doesn't get much of a response at all. If the numbers of fans who claim to hate John Cena and/or Roman Reigns were accurate, if the hostility aimed towards them was a legit claim of how unpopular they are, they wouldn't help generate the sort of revenue that they do.
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  #19  
Old 09-14-2017, 05:22 PM
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In the modern age, fans are going to cheer and boo for whoever they want, often regardless of whatever direction a company tries to steer a wrestler in. Kevin Owens beat up a 72 year old man Tuesday night on SmackDown Live and many of the fans still cheered him just like they always do. On NXT, Pete Dunne left Wolfgang for dead, metaphorically, after Wolfgang came to his aid when the Undisputed were beating the crap out of him; Dunne ran back to the ring not to help but to retrieve his championship rather than help a guy who helped him. That's a very heelish thing to do, the guy looked like a lowlife but a lot of the fans still cheered him. What's he supposed to do? punt kick a puppy with three legs, one eye and no nuts into the crowd? Hell, even if he did, some would still cheer him. Braun Strowman beats up babyfaces all the time, but he gets cheered by a sizeable portion of the fans, partially because of who he beats up as booing guys like Reigns and Cena and they see it as some sort of bullshit rebellion. In NXT, guys like Roderick Strong and Johnny Gargano partially because they're indie guys, they're guys who some fans feel who earned notoriety before they were part of "the machine"; they're talented wrestlers but the fact that they spent their entire careers on the indie scene gives them a leg up with the number of modern fans who let dirt sheet writers tell them what they should think is good instead of forming their own opinion: indie scene is good, big corporate machine is bad.

As I said in a post in the thread suggesting that Strowman be turned face, being labeled a babyface or a heel is pretty much irrelevant in this day and age. Kayfabe is essentially dead and there's no way around it, there hasn't been much of a way around it for the better part of two decades; it's been in a coma on life support due to the internet but what really came along and pulled the plug is social media. People can now not only find out the ins and out afforded them by peeking behind the curtain via the internet, they can now do it anywhere at anytime thanks to phones and tablets.

What wrestling companies have to worry about more is when someone doesn't get much of a response at all. If the numbers of fans who claim to hate John Cena and/or Roman Reigns were accurate, if the hostility aimed towards them was a legit claim of how unpopular they are, they wouldn't help generate the sort of revenue that they do.
i get your point and i totally agree with it, but at the same time i think that why Wrestling as a whole isn't as popular as it use to be when keyfabe still existed. There nothing wrong about knowing what supposedly is going on backstage because let's face it nobody outside of those who works backstage truly knows what's going on and everything that written in newsletter like the wrestling observer are pure speculation in my opinion. But that's what is slowly killing the business. Because now, everybody knows it's fake and nobody wants to suspend their disbelief anymore. To fans it's just entertainment like pretty much any other tv show and i think it's sad that this is happening to wrestling.

The worst part of all of this is when a little kid goes to a wrestling event and still believe in the heel vs babyface scenario and the cheer for the babyface and boo the heel and then their a jerk that goes to the kid and tell them that they are just acting and in the end their no good guy and bad guy, it's just 2 guy pretending to fight and this happen often.

While i do understand that time are changing and keyfabe is dead. I still miss this. I think the closest thing we get in this day and age to a actual old school heel in the keyfabe sense is baron corbin. That's saying something.

In the end, because of social media and the internet in general, wrestling is pretty a bland product which is sad. The weird thing, like jim cornette said multiple time on his podcast, his that MMA is doing wrestling better then wrestling right now. When you think about it that's sad. i wish that we could all go back to the good old day of keyfabe existed and that stuff and that wrestlers would use social media to advance their characters instead of just being themselves on the social account but that dream is pretty much dead and that sad because trying to know to much about the business take the magic away from the business and that's when the product become stale.
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Old 09-14-2017, 07:49 PM
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Nothing's wrong. NXT was on fire because of the names it once had. All the great names that had never wrestled in the WWE all in one place. Now all of them are gone and NXT will go back to being a developmental show.

Its future should become the Cruiserweight division and the UK championship. That would keep it hot for 2 more years.
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