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  #11  
Old 05-24-2017, 10:20 AM
Kodo Sawaki Kodo Sawaki is offline
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Cringy no. But yes, not very good. Fortunately for him that is not his selling point. His entrance is gold and his in ring work is great. So he got over on that. But yeah, in promo department he is very lacking. And I dont have too much sympathy for that because his English should be better. If all us Europeans speak it even if our languages have nothing to do with English, he should not be exception. Maybe Japanese(like some French guys) have a natural hatred toward English or just have want to honor their own culture and refuse to learn it or speak it. But if he wants to be in company that resides in US and with English as native language, there is not much excuse for that. And wouldnt mind Japanese accent as much as I dont mind Becky with her silly accent.
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  #12  
Old 05-24-2017, 10:23 AM
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C'mon, if you can't speak good English, you'd never be in top feuds. Because you can't sell a product. What good is a salesman who can't speak. Initially, I thought it was all part of the act, but now that you guys say that that is actually him, I think it would be really hard for him to survive in WWE.
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  #13  
Old 05-24-2017, 01:31 PM
d_henderson1810 d_henderson1810 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pika View Post
It's incredibly hard to learn English in a case like his. He's made improvements, but it'll never be on par with what most North American or even European fans would want. They're really kind of pushing the "He is Asian. He dances. What an eccentric performer" thing in lethal and transparent doses. Cringe? Not really. I enjoy the "Rockstar" thing a bit more than the awkward prince and Jackson comparison. They have a guy who's worth millions and has proven to garner attention, but he's complex and if one part outweighs the other it's off putting.

Not sure why people on the internet were saying his English was pretty good. It is all things considered, but to someone who doesn't know that struggle or only speaks English it's very low level. Pretty sure you're not the only one, and it's understandable why you probably wouldn't like it. Love Shinsuke, and hearing the effort to say something like "Turning your house into a playground" is not my thing. With a champion who is going to cut the same promo every week in his language. For his people. I'd prefer they start pushing him heavier on the guy who'll decapitate you with a knee rather than silly Japanese man loves rock n roll. I won't complain too much, but build and promo is something that makes his matches great and even classics. They really haven't mishandled him, but they're kind of treading closer to that line. Smackdown fell off hardcore when they literally just lost Miz and Ambrose. Hopefully post money in the bank we see things like this become less of an issue. Especially with the briefcase, orton rematch, new day and rusev returns.
This shows the bullshit on how one of the arguments people have against Roman Reigns is that he is no good on the mike, and how the talkers of the business are the real stars. Yet Shinsuke can't put two coherent words together, but because he has a cool entrance......

Shinsuke is being overrated, and he has only been on the main roster for a few weeks. He is being shoved down our throats more than Roman was when he debuted.

But, many of the fickle wrestling fans like flippity-flippers who have cool entrances and music, who come from NXT and who aren't muscle-bound, rather than guys who Vince rates, because he rates them, and you can't allow yourself to agree with Vinnie Mac.

When Shinsuke struggles to get out words while pulling a face like he is taking a dump, you all pat him on the head and say "He is trying.....and he has a cool entrance". But when Roman Reigns fails to cut promos like the Rock, you all shit on him. Good that you judge everyone by the same measure.
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  #14  
Old 05-24-2017, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
Shinsuke is being overrated, and he has only been on the main roster for a few weeks. He is being shoved down our throats more than Roman was when he debuted
The guy who has had one match? You mean the guy who hasn't even been on SmackDown every week since his debut? The guy who's entrance didn't even make the broadcast last night? If you considering that threat shoving I worry for your gag reflex.

I enjoy him. Not everyone needs to speak perfect English. He has a certain charisma about him that you just can't teach. He'll be fine.
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  #15  
Old 05-24-2017, 04:27 PM
d_henderson1810 d_henderson1810 is offline
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Originally Posted by Stone Cold Tea View Post
The guy who has had one match? You mean the guy who hasn't even been on SmackDown every week since his debut? The guy who's entrance didn't even make the broadcast last night? If you considering that threat shoving I worry for your gag reflex.

I enjoy him. Not everyone needs to speak perfect English. He has a certain charisma about him that you just can't teach. He'll be fine.
I have heard many talk on here incessantly about Nakamura, how great he was as NXT Champion, how great he was in Japan. 2K even had a special NXT edition of the WWE2K17 game where you can get autographed copies of the game by Shinsuke Nakamura.

Hey, I enjoy Nakamura too. He does have a cool entrance, I liked his match with Ziggler at Backlash, and his entrance would look especially awesome at Wrestlemania. He would be a good U.S. or IC Champion.

My problem is Nakamura, but the fans' hypocrisy of what they level as bad things about Roman Reigns don't seem to be levelled at Nakamura just as much.

If Nakamura was all over SD Live, people wouldn't bitch here about it like they do Roman on RAW, because more Nakamura means more cool entrance. You would only turn on Nakamura if it was reported that Vince sees him as "the guy", then you will all turn on him, because you can't like Vince's endorsed guy, just like the lot of you couldn't get behind Cena or Roman.

If fans just admitted that they don't like guys on top who aren't indy darlings or flip-flop guys, then maybe I wouldn't have to point out how fans are inconsistent in their arguments of why they don't get behind one person, while ignoring similar flaws in another.
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  #16  
Old 05-24-2017, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
This shows the bullshit on how one of the arguments people have against Roman Reigns is that he is no good on the mike, and how the talkers of the business are the real stars. Yet Shinsuke can't put two coherent words together, but because he has a cool entrance......

Shinsuke is being overrated, and he has only been on the main roster for a few weeks. He is being shoved down our throats more than Roman was when he debuted.

But, many of the fickle wrestling fans like flippity-flippers who have cool entrances and music, who come from NXT and who aren't muscle-bound, rather than guys who Vince rates, because he rates them, and you can't allow yourself to agree with Vinnie Mac.
As has been pointed out he's had one match since he debuted on the main roster. Can you please tell us how that is shoving someone down our throats? Nakamura doesn't do flippy stuff either, he is a straight up wrestler, so don't know where that is coming from.

And please explain why we always have to agree with Vince? In your eyes anyone who doesn't agree with Vince is a crap wrestling fan. I say that because you bring it up constantly. Can you not understand for one minute that people are different and might not like the guy that Vince decide's should be on top?

When it comes to Reigns English is his first language and since you bring up the Rock, of course he is going to be compared to him. When the Rock shows up at the Rumble to try and help get Reigns over, what do you expect. You almost act like it's the fans fault that Reigns can cut a promo to save his life, when in fact it's his fault. Reigns has been on the roster for 5 years now, in among some of the promo artists in Jericho, Rollins, Heyman and Owens. It's really not the fans problem that he just isn't in their league.
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  #17  
Old 05-25-2017, 03:16 AM
d_henderson1810 d_henderson1810 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navi View Post
As has been pointed out he's had one match since he debuted on the main roster. Can you please tell us how that is shoving someone down our throats? Nakamura doesn't do flippy stuff either, he is a straight up wrestler, so don't know where that is coming from.

And please explain why we always have to agree with Vince? In your eyes anyone who doesn't agree with Vince is a crap wrestling fan. I say that because you bring it up constantly. Can you not understand for one minute that people are different and might not like the guy that Vince decide's should be on top?

When it comes to Reigns English is his first language and since you bring up the Rock, of course he is going to be compared to him. When the Rock shows up at the Rumble to try and help get Reigns over, what do you expect. You almost act like it's the fans fault that Reigns can cut a promo to save his life, when in fact it's his fault. Reigns has been on the roster for 5 years now, in among some of the promo artists in Jericho, Rollins, Heyman and Owens. It's really not the fans problem that he just isn't in their league.
I don't always agree with Vince, but I back a billionaire who is running the most successful wrestling company on earth to know what he is doing, over some fans who sit on the computer all day and tell him how to do it better.

His bank account probably is why I back his decision making. WWE would be dead today if Vince got it wrong all the time.

Also, it didn't seem to bother any of you when Roman was in NXT, or in the Shield. The time you people started commenting on his poor in-ring and promo skills was around the time that Vince started pushing Roman to the moon. Just like when fans turned on Cena, who they used to cheer as the "Doctor Of Thuganomics" but started booing when he started main-eventing. Coincidence?

You cheer Nakamura now because he is "flavour of the month", he is the fans' "new toy", until they get tired of him, and want the next sensation from NXT to come up.

Why even care what Roman's mike skills are like, if you are happy to accept Nakamura with poor mike skills? But I had better not read any more guff about how you need to be a maestro on the mike to be over, as Nakamura disproves this.

You ask me why I always agree with Vince? How come you always disagree with him?
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  #18  
Old 05-25-2017, 05:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
This shows the bullshit on how one of the arguments people have against Roman Reigns is that he is no good on the mike,
Except that it isn't bullshit since he isn't good on the mic.

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and how the talkers of the business are the real stars.
Yeah, the real stars are good talkers.

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Yet Shinsuke can't put two coherent words together,
Really? I doubt that it's this bad.

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but because he has a cool entrance......
The entrance is cool, so?

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Shinsuke is being overrated, and he has only been on the main roster for a few weeks.
If someone says that he's the greatest ever then he's overrated. No one and I emphasize, No one is saying that.

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He is being shoved down our throats more than Roman was when he debuted.
Shoving down throats is something else which Nakamura isn't being.

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But, many of the fickle wrestling fans like flippity-flippers
Flippity-flippers? Or rather a style of wrestling you don't like?

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who have cool entrances and music,
Roman Reigns has a cool music. Entrance was also cool, so?

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who come from NXT
Liking someone from NXT is bad?

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and who aren't muscle-bound,
It isn't about muscles. It's about talent.

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rather than guys who Vince rates, because he rates them, and
Difference of opinions or tastes? Is it bad?

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you can't allow yourself to agree with Vinnie Mac.
Why? Will I be fined for agreeing with Vince? Many people agree with him about various matters and disagree with him about some other matters.

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When Shinsuke struggles to get out words while pulling a face like he is taking a dump, you all pat him on the head and say "He is trying.....and he has a cool entrance".
Are you sure that he's struggling? Yes? If yes, then convince me that he's actually struggling.

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But when Roman Reigns fails to cut promos like the Rock, you all shit on him.
Roman Reigns is going to main event 4th consecutive Wrestlemania. Nakamura just defeated Ziggler. Who needs better promos? Cut promos like Rock? Lol, no one is expecting that from Roman Reigns.

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Good that you judge everyone by the same measure.
Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
I have heard many talk on here incessantly about Nakamura,
Because he's interesting.

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how great he was as NXT Champion,
He was good indeed.

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how great he was in Japan.
Yes.

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2K even had a special NXT edition of the WWE2K17 game where you can get autographed copies of the game by Shinsuke Nakamura.
Because people like him and want his autographs. No problem in it.

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Hey, I enjoy Nakamura too.
Same Pinch.

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He does have a cool entrance,
True.

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I liked his match with Ziggler at Backlash, and his entrance would look especially awesome at Wrestlemania. He would be a good U.S. or IC Champion.
Agreed.

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My problem is Nakamura, but the fans' hypocrisy of what they level as bad things about Roman Reigns don't seem to be levelled at Nakamura just as much.
Look fans are hypocrites. But not all. Just like people in real life. But why are you generalizing like as if everyone who doesn't like Roman Reigns and likes Nakamura is a hypocrite? And how in the blue sky are Roman Reigns and Shinsuke Nakamura even comparable? Shinsuke is a wrestling veteran and one of the biggest NJPW stars. Roman Reigns is gradually coming up. But they aren't comparable by any measure.

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If Nakamura was all over SD Live, people wouldn't bitch here about it like they do Roman on RAW, because more Nakamura means more cool entrance.
And how can you say so? How can you assume so? Any proof about it whatsoever?

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You would only turn on Nakamura if it was reported that Vince sees him as "the guy", then you will all turn on him, because you can't like Vince's endorsed guy,
You really concentrate on Vince too much. I don't care what he likes or not. It's not like I'm in opposition of his government, right? People have varying opinions and choices.

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just like the lot of you couldn't get behind Cena or Roman.
And those have some genuine reasons for it as well. Don't say that there aren't any genuine reasons?

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If fans just admitted that
Hypocrites will never admit that they are wrong. Fans will.

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they don't like guys on top who aren't indy darlings or flip-flop guys,
Aha. The same guys that wrestle in a style that doesn't interest you, right? They are flip-flops just because you don't like their style? Or rather the background of independent that they came from?

By the way, Flip-flops are awesome. Nah, not the ones you referred. I mean actual flip-flops. Always love them.

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then maybe I wouldn't have to point out how fans are inconsistent in their arguments of why they don't get behind one person, while ignoring similar flaws in another.
There are flaws in both Roman Reigns and Shinsuke Nakamura. However, everyone has flaws. I have plenty of flaws. Don't know about you though. Take another example. Cesaro isn't good on mic but I love him for his in-ring work. Roman Reigns isn't good on mic but I still like him. But Cesaro can afford to have mediocre mic skills but your face Roman Reigns can't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
I don't always agree with Vince,
Good for ya.

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but I back a billionaire who is running the most successful wrestling company on earth to know what he is doing,
So you back billionaires only? Successful doesn't mean right.

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over some fans who sit on the computer all day and tell him how to do it better.
Damn, I don't like computer. That's why I never use it. Thanks for another generalization though. The status doesn't show who's right or wrong. A billionaire actor is a murderer here and hasn't got any repercussions. I haven't even started working but I'm better than at least him because I didn't do that crime. Money never tells who's right and wrong. Never.

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His bank account probably is why I back his decision making.
I can't agree with it.

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WWE would be dead today if Vince got it wrong all the time.
Who said that he gets it wrong all the time?

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Also, it didn't seem to bother any of you when Roman was in NXT,
Eh. Never seen him on NXT. Again generalization.

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or in the Shield.
Yeah, because he was protected and actually booked rightly?

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The time you people started commenting on his poor in-ring and promo skills was around the time that Vince started pushing Roman to the moon.
Yes, because someone on moon should be better than someone in a stable. Not to forget how Roman Reigns was a silent badass in Shield. Where's that guy?

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Just like when fans turned on Cena, who they used to cheer as the "Doctor Of Thuganomics" but started booing when he started main-eventing.
Or maybe they didn't like John Cena's gimmick? I don't like his gimmick. He's a good wrestler nonetheless.

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Coincidence?
Maybe. Maybe not. God knows better.

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You cheer Nakamura now because he is "flavour of the month"
Or maybe he's actually good since people have seen his work.

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, he is the fans' "new toy",
Toys are awesome for children.

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until they get tired of him,
Or until they misuse him? Or until they push him too hard.

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and want the next sensation from NXT to come up.
Is it bad to want someone good to come from NXT?

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Why even care what Roman's mike skills are like, if you are happy to accept Nakamura with poor mike skills?
Again comparing apples and oranges. Who needs mic skills more? A guy who has just debuted or a guy who has already headlined 3 consecutive Wrestlemanias? Something Stone Cold Steve Austin couldn't do.

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But I had better not read any more guff about how you need to be a maestro on the mike to be over, as Nakamura disproves this.
We'll see when Nakamura gets shoved to throats like Roman Reigns, okay?

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You ask me why I always agree with Vince?
Nah. Maybe your opinions and tastes are similar.

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How come you always disagree with him?
Eh. Again generalization. I wouldn't be watching WWE if I always disagreed with Vince.
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  #19  
Old 05-25-2017, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_henderson1810 View Post
I don't always agree with Vince, but I back a billionaire who is running the most successful wrestling company on earth to know what he is doing, over some fans who sit on the computer all day and tell him how to do it better.

His bank account probably is why I back his decision making. WWE would be dead today if Vince got it wrong all the time.

Also, it didn't seem to bother any of you when Roman was in NXT, or in the Shield. The time you people started commenting on his poor in-ring and promo skills was around the time that Vince started pushing Roman to the moon. Just like when fans turned on Cena, who they used to cheer as the "Doctor Of Thuganomics" but started booing when he started main-eventing. Coincidence?

You cheer Nakamura now because he is "flavour of the month", he is the fans' "new toy", until they get tired of him, and want the next sensation from NXT to come up.

Why even care what Roman's mike skills are like, if you are happy to accept Nakamura with poor mike skills? But I had better not read any more guff about how you need to be a maestro on the mike to be over, as Nakamura disproves this.

You ask me why I always agree with Vince? How come you always disagree with him?
I don't always disagree with McMahon either, and yes he does get a lot right, but as a fan when he pushes someone I don't particularly care for and it's a 3 year push, then I will say something. No one else that I can remember in all the year's I've watched wrestling has received the kind of push and rubs that Roman Reigns has received. All you have to do is read comments and listen to the boo's too tell you that. People are sick of Reigns now and the boo's will eventually stop and then the WWE will have a top babyface that gets no reaction at all. As a matter of fact I read awhile ago that Vince had given up on Reigns, it was HHH who wanted to continue the push so who knows.

When Reigns was in NXT no one really knew who he was, the brand was new and it wasn't watched like it is now, so I didn't watch him much. As for the Shield, yes he was over because the Shield was over as a group. Rollins, Ambrose and Reigns were the most over faction on the roster, if you remember correctly we didn't hear much from Reigns at all. Ambrose and Rollins did most of the mic work Reigns was the silent badass who used to come in and finish matches. It wasn't until he struck out on his own that we found out why he was so silent when he was in the Shield, his shortcomings were on display for everyone to see.

Again Cena was over long before people started booing him. They only started booing him when his gimmick became stale but they respect the hell out of the guy for his work ethic, wrestling skills and charity work. No one else on the roster puts the hours in that he does and he carried the WWE on his back for most of the last decade. Besides Cena knows how to work a hostile crowd in a way that most other wrestlers don't.

I cheer Nakamura for one reason and one reason only, the guy is great in the ring. His match will Sami Zayn while both were still in NXT was one I won't forget in a hurry. He has spent years honing his skills and it shows. His entrance is cool, but the best part of Nakamura comes out when he's kicking the crap out of someone. He might not be as cut as some of the others, but the guy can go in the ring.

Listen I don't give a damm about Reigns and his mic skills, they are not there and he's had enough time to get it right. He will always have his fans and his detractors like every wrestler does. Nakamura will have his fans and people that don't care for him much as well. That's the way wrestling works, we like some and we don't like others. It doesn't mean that any of us are wrong, it's just different tastes and that's something you have to get used too.
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  #20  
Old 05-25-2017, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Navi View Post
I don't always disagree with McMahon either, and yes he does get a lot right, but as a fan when he pushes someone I don't particularly care for and it's a 3 year push, then I will say something. No one else that I can remember in all the year's I've watched wrestling has received the kind of push and rubs that Roman Reigns has received. All you have to do is read comments and listen to the boo's too tell you that. People are sick of Reigns now and the boo's will eventually stop and then the WWE will have a top babyface that gets no reaction at all. As a matter of fact I read awhile ago that Vince had given up on Reigns, it was HHH who wanted to continue the push so who knows.

When Reigns was in NXT no one really knew who he was, the brand was new and it wasn't watched like it is now, so I didn't watch him much. As for the Shield, yes he was over because the Shield was over as a group. Rollins, Ambrose and Reigns were the most over faction on the roster, if you remember correctly we didn't hear much from Reigns at all. Ambrose and Rollins did most of the mic work Reigns was the silent badass who used to come in and finish matches. It wasn't until he struck out on his own that we found out why he was so silent when he was in the Shield, his shortcomings were on display for everyone to see.

Again Cena was over long before people started booing him. They only started booing him when his gimmick became stale but they respect the hell out of the guy for his work ethic, wrestling skills and charity work. No one else on the roster puts the hours in that he does and he carried the WWE on his back for most of the last decade. Besides Cena knows how to work a hostile crowd in a way that most other wrestlers don't.

I cheer Nakamura for one reason and one reason only, the guy is great in the ring. His match will Sami Zayn while both were still in NXT was one I won't forget in a hurry. He has spent years honing his skills and it shows. His entrance is cool, but the best part of Nakamura comes out when he's kicking the crap out of someone. He might not be as cut as some of the others, but the guy can go in the ring.

Listen I don't give a damm about Reigns and his mic skills, they are not there and he's had enough time to get it right. He will always have his fans and his detractors like every wrestler does. Nakamura will have his fans and people that don't care for him much as well. That's the way wrestling works, we like some and we don't like others. It doesn't mean that any of us are wrong, it's just different tastes and that's something you have to get used too.
If you want Reigns to be the silent assassin, fair enough. Maybe he should have a mouthpiece, like Lesnar has Paul Heyman. But if he doesn't speak on the mike, and is more like the "Shield" version of Roman Reigns, then the argument that a wrestler has to be great on the mike to be over (except Kane circa-1997-2000, Mortician Undertaker, Chris Benoit, Bret Hart and even Brock Lesnar, who were all stars and all popular despite not cutting world class promos, so stick work making one popular applies to who you choose to apply it to) will be shown as a fallacy.

So many are critical of Roman on the mike. Okay, so have him be the top guy, and have his opponent do the heavy lifting, and Reigns spear him after the speech. Will that make you all love Roman then, or does he have to do more?
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