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  #1  
Old 01-05-2012, 07:16 PM
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Default Why I WILL be voting for D Double...

Okay, if you're in this section, you'll know that there is a substantial thread on reasons why people shouldn't vote for the ABC Party Candidate, Dagger Dias. Well, this is a free forum and that is their prerogative but I think it's time to say a couple of things.



First off, Dagger was voted the ABC Candidate fair and square. He dominated the first vote and, whilst closer, he comfortably made it through the second primary as well to become the ABC Candidate to take on Coco and Crock. The ABC Party was set up as a bunch of respectful and forward thinking members who had wide ranges of interests but were willing to get behind whoever the ultimate candidate might be.

Now a quick membership history, I initially joined Killjoy's WFU Party as I was interested in an additional TNA mod. KJ quickly amalgamated with the ABC Party and seeing the quality of the names this linked us with I couldn't have been happier. I, along with some help, persuaded JWGunslinger to throw his (cowboy) hat into the ring but as his heart didn't really appear to be in it (he was very quiet at promoting his excellent track record) I voted for KJ in the first primary, assisting him in making the second primary, behind Habs and runaway winner Dagger. Now, as both Habs and KJ were clear on their intentions to join IDR in the TNA section, I held back to see which would get more support and, with a heavy heart, gave my suppport to Habs (not because I don't like him but because I didn't like moving from my initial guy). All in vain, however, as D Double had the ground support to win out.

This should illustrate that I was far from a mark for Dagger. Dias won the election fair and square and I have had no issue in putting my full support into his campaign to become our next WrestleZone Forum mod. That's what being part of a party is about, if your guy (or gal) doesn't get through, you don't take your ball and go home - you throw your support behind the person your compatriots have deemed worthy.



In the, strangely venomous, anti Dagger thread I have picked up on a couple of things that I felt should be addressed:

Dagger has been accused of using rep to bribe votes. All of the primaries were private votes, there is no way he could know who voted for him.

He appears to have a group of mods who are hellbent on him winning the election. I may be wrong but I was under the impression that this election was to put the power of electing the next mod in the hands of the members, not the mods so I would encourage people to make up their own minds rather than be influenced by the great and the good who I'm sure have more than their fair share in the traditional method of appointing mods.

D Double apparently PMs to much. Sorry, does PM not stand for 'PRIVATE Message'? And what does that prove? That he is enthusiastic, perhaps?

The GMods will not allow him in if he wins. Seriously, if they don't want Dias to win, he wouldn't be still in the election. So it appears that Sly and KB are, at least, willing to accept him.

His posting quality varies...
Quote:
John 8:7
Let him who is without sin cast the first stone.
He hasn't defended himself. Why would anyone wish to enter a thread that is set up to do nothing but slate you bother, the haters will still hate and his supporters will still support him. This is the calm logical way to treat such a thread.

He loses his temper and takes things to personally. As just stated, it appears that he is learning to take a deep breath and not just rush in.

He is incapable of learning or improving... see above again.

He isn't liked. Well he has been a clear winner for the largest parties candidacy (even without my votes), so it appears to me that he must be getting some love.

Only simpletons and newbies like him because he green reps all round him to be liked and this might actually win him the election. How condescending is this? Plus, Rep is also private, so the degree of this is highly subjective and, if it is true, it would make more sense to give your green to higher rep people on the idea of receiving the same - it takes a long long time to get to 1,000 points 1 point at a time. That would be remarkably unselfish.


I'm not going to demand anyone votes for DD. What I will say is that ABC members should vote their party candidate and that you non party members have a simple decision: Dagger Dias or Crock for the WWe section (pick your favorite folks) or Coco for the spam sections. Coco could easily attain this modship without the need for this election as he has both the rep and enough current and prior mod support to fill what is essentially a vacant post and I doubt that you would find anyone who would oppose that decision as he is extremely qualified in this section (although I would still question the need, Coco and Sam seem to keep any problem makers in check without the powers of modship). As such, why waste an opportunity to put in someone who isn't in as strong a position. If you want your vote to mean something, vote for D Double or Crock. Ideally from my perspective, my ABC brother Dagger Dias.

Thankee-sai
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Old 01-05-2012, 07:21 PM
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Did you see the way he responded to people who didn't like his game?


I like him but the man does not take criticism well
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:05 PM
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Damn sleep and work! I've responded to everyone that I feel was addressing myself, unless they have already been covered by a fellow supporter. Thanks for all the considered responses, it been enjoyable to engage with y'all

Quote:
Originally Posted by hyourinmaru View Post
Did you see the way he responded to people who didn't like his game?

I like him but the man does not take criticism well
I have seen this highlighted many times but I am unaware of anyone illustrating any real record of him having a noted history of unfavorable reaction to things not of his own creation (ie people disagreeing with his opinions). Would God have taken it well if Budda, Zeus and Odin had laughed at man (" What's that useless piece of flesh meant to do? ") or would a parent react well to laughter at their offspring?

WrestleZone isn't his creation so what would he have to take as an attack of something that is his?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harthan View Post
Do you think it's a coincidence that the majority of his detractors are members with longer tenures and staff experience, while the majority of his supporters are the opposite?
About as big a coincidence of those detractors being friends and supporters of Coco.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamond Dallas Page View Post
FF4L, as usual you raise good points. However, I must disagree that voting for Coco would prevent the vote from "meaning something". Sometimes, the key to getting on staff is letting people know that there is, in fact, a need, and you are the best [or only] person to fill that need. I became Graphics Mod after demonstrating that there was in fact a need for one, through my reported posts and posts in the section. Previously, there hadn't been a Graphics Mod for quite some time. Now, we can obviously make good arguments about me annoying my way to the position, but the fact remains that I showed there was a need and I was chosen to fill it.

Now, this shows that just because the need for a Spam Mod hasn't been filled or previously brought to light, does not mean it doesn't exist. This election has just made it clear. What need would Dagger or Crock fill that the current WWE team does not already? We have Jack-Hammer for discussion, and Nate and Nick for cleanup. Since you are supporting him, what can Dagger bring to the table?
Thanks, Doc and you make a compelling argument. However, you answer your own question. Asides from his own formidable ability to lobby for the post, he is supported by current mods. Unless there is something that I am not aware of with the G-Mods, he should have absolutely getting the position, which would mean that the voters would be performing a job that is unnecessary.

The WWe is, by far, the biggest section (four sub-sections) and receives the largest amount of non-spam traffic. Nick and Nate have seniority, so in a team game, I'd give one of them the option of joining my old buddy Jack as a discussion driver. Dagger would then take his place under the wing of the member who remains in clean up and learns the ropes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CDR View Post
The "Why I won't vote for Dagger" thread was posted on the 3rd. This was made on the 5th. That should be indicative of Dagger's support, no?
Ah, the impulsive nature of youth. Asides from the fact that Dias supporters have posted regularly in the anti-Dagger thread, I was waiting until I saw some criticisms before performing a positive rebuttal thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelgarin View Post
So... have I got this right?

You concede that Coco is qualified enough to become mod based on his own merits alone, and that Dagger is not... and you are using this as a pretext to vote for Dagger?
Quote:
SlyFox696
The WrestleZone Forums Administration is proud to bring the community the very first WrestleZone Elections! Over the years of this forum's re-birth from the crash of '06, WZ has seen many members come and go, some doing so garnering respect and Staff positions, some seeing Prison time, but many others just living in the world of the forums. It's been those who have garnered respect and been awarded Staff positions which have traditionally held some of the most controversial debates, with regular community members claiming being on Staff is purely a popularity contest, a charge which has been denied and debunked on numerous occasions. After all, Lord Sidious was a Moderator and nobody liked him.

However, all of that is about to change because now, for the first time, a Staff member will be chosen completely on the grounds of popularity! It will not, however, be the popularity of a poster with the current members of the Staff, but based on popularity with the members of WZ. That's right, every member on the WrestleZone Forums will have their chance to vote for the newest member to the WZ Staff. How will all of this work, you might ask? Read on for the Election rules.
Of course Coco is qualified to be spam mod, he ticks all the boxes in Sly's first paragraph but, as this also indicates, he doesn't require this election to attain this position. The ABC was straightforward in dedicating itself to electing a non-spam mod and the bolded part shows why we are fully supported in the spirit of this exercise to want someone who doesn't tick the previous paragraph's boxes. My idea of this election is to elect the underdog, the guy who mightn't otherwise be considered for quite some time but that the members of the forum do believe deserves that chance. Dagger aced our party, so he is our embodiment of this ideal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
So what your entire post essentially boils down to is that you're voting for Dagger out of party loyalty and that since I'm already worthy of my getting my mod spot on merit alone, everyone should vote for a charity case like Dagger who has no chance of making mod but this?

Interesting strategy. You used the term "forward thinking" to describe ABC Party members. Would you be willing to define that for me?
I believe I have addressed your first paragraph in reply to Mr Gelgarin, sir but if you do not believe so, I'd be more than happy to clarify.

In response to the "forward thinking", first and foremost (and we have had this called into question) we wanted to place forward a less established but quality candidate. We also didn't narrow our vision as a party, we didn't say "You can't be in our party, we're not interested in the Video Game section". We simply wanted non-spam candidates (another party was already championing this cause quite well). As I stated in my original post, I brow beat JWG into putting his name forward and I also asked Notorious as I felt both these guys are relatively new and could bring a younger eye to the forum. Dagger won through the elections, so it is his responsibility to carry forward this ideal. I'm not suggesting anarchy in the WZ, just that someone outside of the guys with the biggest reps might, just might, bring in new ideas that could be to the benefit to our little piece of the IWC.

Quote:
JGlass
I'm not ignoring your post J, but LSN has addressed it. I do apologize for the typo, just put it down to my advanced years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega View Post
So the arguments for Dagger are "he is in my party" (so what?) and "he appears to be learning" (cool, but does that make a good mod?)? That's not enough for me.
If a party has a mandate that they all believe in, is it not weak willed to bail the first time something doesn't go your way? "Oh no, I didn't get Habs through! Sod this, I'm going to join DFP!" Yup, I'd feel really good about myself wouldn't you, or is jumping ship a quality in your world?

Where did I say "He appears to be learning"? You really shouldn't use quote marks when you are not quoting. However, when he is accused of being incapable of learning and there is evidence to the contrary, should the accusation not be debunked? No matter who wins this election, they will have to 'learn' to be mods - that makes learning a valid skill, yes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GD View Post
Nate and JGlass have brought up the need for a spam mod multiple times, errybody stop deying it. I still don't know why there is such a fuss about this though. Coco is a good poster, Dagger is not a good poster. Simple as that.
Erm, think my main point was that Coco does not require to win to become spam mod and, as such, does not need this election. Once again, you join the list of detractors providing evidence to support this claim. As for Dagger's quality, Coco provided an average post to show his lack of quality. Is everyone of your posts A* quality, is anybodies (well, maybe Sly's)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Champ View Post
I don't know much about Dagger, but I do know that mods need to be thick skinned. If he's that sensitive then I don't see a potential mod tenure working out well.
He reacted to a personal creation being criticized. He hasn't, however, been attacked for reacting bad to any other circumstance. One swallow does not a Summer make.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Man View Post
This thread... I like it.
Expound, please?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy "Two-Times" Mozzarella View Post
I'm more interested in why he called him "D Double" when there's a perfect opportunity for "Double D"

Because Dagger has tits.

Because he's a woman
Thought I'd avoid someone embarrassing themselves by making obvious sexual innuendos or hermaphrodite slurs, guess you don't blush easy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelgarin View Post
In the UK potential Conservative leader David Davis already tried that one - he even had large chested women accompany him bearing the slogan "I'd for Double D". It didn't work.
Example of classy use of the pun, didn't need to make an obvious personal attack. Instead, uses history to create a subtle insinuation that the candidate is doomed. Not the case, but still very classy.
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FitFinlay4Life View Post
About as big a coincidence of those detractors being friends and supporters of Coco.
Hey now I can't fucking stand Coco and hope he loses too
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hyourinmaru View Post
Hey now I can't fucking stand Coco and hope he loses too
I'll turn you all, one by one, with my soothing tones...
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FitFinlay4Life View Post

About as big a coincidence of those detractors being friends and supporters of Coco.
You're either missing or evading the point. Why are the posters with the most experience and respect on the forums supporting Coco - or, more accurately, not supporting Dagger?
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harthan View Post
You're either missing or evading the point. Why are the posters with the most experience and respect on the forums supporting Coco - or, more accurately, not supporting Dagger?
These posters with the most experience and respect on the forums were supporting Coco regardless of his opponent. I'm quite sure if KJ or myself had advanced, they would have supported Coco over us too. Hell, long before we identified our candidate, when there were numerous other options, many of whom are also experienced and respected, these guys were backing Coco. And that's perfectly fine, their prerogative. The fact that these experienced and respected posters back Coco doesn't automatically mean they're correct, it simply reflects their opinions. And as a classy guy like Tastycles suggested, his opinion does not nor should not count for any more than anyone else.

But if we want to go down this road, there are plenty of well respected and experienced guys in the ABC Party. Mustang Sally. Jack-Hammer. LSN. Falkon. Mitch Henessey. Big Sexy. Shattered Dreams. Theo. And many many more. The suggestion that Coco is supported by the only guys that matter around here, and the only supporters of the ABC Party are nameless nobodies, is wrong on all accounts.
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FitFinlay4Life View Post
The WWe is, by far, the biggest section (four sub-sections) and receives the largest amount of non-spam traffic. Nick and Nate have seniority, so in a team game, I'd give one of them the option of joining my old buddy Jack as a discussion driver. Dagger would then take his place under the wing of the member who remains in clean up and learns the ropes.
Sounds like you're refining Dagger's position on the fly to fit your argument because Dagger's actual intention of driving discussion has been exposed as severely flawed considering he isn't capable of that. You're living in a fantasy land.

Quote:
Ah, the impulsive nature of youth. Asides from the fact that Dias supporters have posted regularly in the anti-Dagger thread, I was waiting until I saw some criticisms before performing a positive rebuttal thread.
See, this IS a rebuttal thread. Now where are the actual reasons I should vote FOR Dagger.

Quote:
My idea of this election is to elect the underdog, the guy who mightn't otherwise be considered for quite some time but that the members of the forum do believe deserves that chance. Dagger aced our party, so he is our embodiment of this ideal.
Dagger's an idiot who never has a chance of becoming mod through conventional means. You've essential said that your entire party holds the ideal that electing someone of that ilk is a good thing. I think that answers any questions people had about Dagger making a mockery of the process.

Quote:
In response to the "forward thinking", first and foremost (and we have had this called into question) we wanted to place forward a less established but quality candidate. We also didn't narrow our vision as a party, we didn't say "You can't be in our party, we're not interested in the Video Game section". We simply wanted non-spam candidates (another party was already championing this cause quite well). As I stated in my original post, I brow beat JWG into putting his name forward and I also asked Notorious as I felt both these guys are relatively new and could bring a younger eye to the forum. Dagger won through the elections, so it is his responsibility to carry forward this ideal. I'm not suggesting anarchy in the WZ, just that someone outside of the guys with the biggest reps might, just might, bring in new ideas that could be to the benefit to our little piece of the IWC.
So this isn't about Dagger being good enough for the spot, this is a vote of protest against the evil establishment. Nice to know you're in this for the right reasons.

Quote:
If a party has a mandate that they all believe in, is it not weak willed to bail the first time something doesn't go your way? "Oh no, I didn't get Habs through! Sod this, I'm going to join DFP!" Yup, I'd feel really good about myself wouldn't you, or is jumping ship a quality in your world?
This isn't about mindless flag-waving or loyalty. A party isn't getting elected. A mod is. Dagger won't make for a good mod as much as the ABC is obsessed with victory at the expense of the good of the forum.

Quote:
Erm, think my main point was that Coco does not require to win to become spam mod and, as such, does not need this election. Once again, you join the list of detractors providing evidence to support this claim. As for Dagger's quality, Coco provided an average post to show his lack of quality. Is everyone of your posts A* quality, is anybodies (well, maybe Sly's)?
None of Dagger's posts ever creep above a C-. My posts don't have to be consistently in the A+ range to top Dagger.

Also, "Coco deserves it the most" is still a terrible argument. But please do continue saying it as I love hearing nice things about myself.

Quote:
Expound, please?
That's a request, not a question.

Looks like more of the same from the ABC Party. Everyone who doesn't jump off that ship at this point is really showing what they're made of intellectually.
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Old 01-06-2012, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
Sounds like you're refining Dagger's position on the fly to fit your argument because Dagger's actual intention of driving discussion has been exposed as severely flawed considering he isn't capable of that. You're living in a fantasy land.
Refined what? Doc asked me how I would use DD, I come from a generation that respected their superiors and strove to learn from them. Mayhaps you think I should have said that he should walk straight in as head of the section?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
See, this IS a rebuttal thread. Now where are the actual reasons I should vote FOR Dagger.
Nope, but if I hadn't addressed the issues that JGlass's thread was raising, I'd have been called on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
Dagger's an idiot who never has a chance of becoming mod through conventional means. You've essential said that your entire party holds the ideal that electing someone of that ilk is a good thing. I think that answers any questions people had about Dagger making a mockery of the process.
So you don't respect any of my party? Fair enough, say what you will but we operated an open honest and democratic election, were there was doubt as to who would win through and a number of viable candidates. Rather than a party and ethos built around one guy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
So this isn't about Dagger being good enough for the spot, this is a vote of protest against the evil establishment. Nice to know you're in this for the right reasons.
Hmmm, stop reading between the lines - I may be a white man but I sure don't speak with forked tongue. I respect the establishment here and I have went on the record on many occasions to that effect. Is it sacrilege to suggest that a newbie might have good ideas? Dagger won a contested election in the largest party of this election, I'd say he has the ability.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
This isn't about mindless flag-waving or loyalty. A party isn't getting elected. A mod is. Dagger won't make for a good mod as much as the ABC is obsessed with victory at the expense of the good of the forum.
So every member of the DFP isn't voting Coco? Please! Yes, a mod is being elected and as much as you like to play Nostradamus, you cannot state he will not be a good mod.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
None of Dagger's posts ever creep above a C-. My posts don't have to be consistently in the A+ range to top Dagger.
Your opinion, my main experience with Dias was in the Superhero Tournament were my love of Marvel collided with his love of computer game characters. His posts were uniformly excellent, well informed and (whisper it) calm - despite my dogged insistence that he was wrong and my character would win.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
Also, "Coco deserves it the most" is still a terrible argument. But please do continue saying it as I love hearing nice things about myself.
I've no issue saying you are deserving of being spam mod. I don't think you deserve to win this election. I'll say it again: with your backers, you'd have no problem getting the post anyway which makes the election mute asides from a possible ego buffing exercise. Plus, your party and supporters have ran a very dirty campaign were your name doesn't get mentioned at all in many threads by BFPers and they exist just to slander and that even predates Dagger's election.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
That's a request, not a question.
Damn it! C- for me, then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
Looks like more of the same from the ABC Party. Everyone who doesn't jump off that ship at this point is really showing what they're made of intellectually.
Sterner stuff than your smear campaign can affect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco The Monkey View Post
That's enough of that. I commend my crew for having good judgement high enough standards to jump on the only ship they knew was worth riding to the Board Room. Look at you ABC Party guys: Waxing on about loyalty. From day one, you knew you'd open your legs for whoever won your party's nomination. And there were a lot of candidates in the running. But you guys are so easy that you'd slob any of their knobs. Pretty promiscuous stuff. It makes my skin crawl to imagine your mother setting that example for you.
Your right, every single member of the DFP wanting to fellate (using your analogy) is a much better example. Please don't bring my mum into it because we both know you have me at a disadvantage, it's impossible for me to insult a lady that neither of us know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega View Post
Is this election about victory for a party or getting a good mod for the forums? I don't see ships in this thing, I see candidates who would be better or worse for these forums.

If you vote for him because he would've voted for you if you won the primaries, isn't your vote about selfish status enhancement and not about what's best for WZ's quality then?
If a party has strong foundations and has great supporters like LSN, Sally and Mitch (to name three), why is supporting the candidate who fairly earns the right to represent us selfish status enhancement - surely that would be more the case if you created a party in your own image?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega View Post
Wouldn't it be better if we could be sure of this quality? The other candidates appear to be much more cool-headed. This is more of a one-way road - either you stay calm or you prove (or at least suggest) to be a hothead, which Dagger did. It's a character trait and not likely to go away with time.
Outside of the infamous 'game' thread, I still haven't seen any evidence of this being a character trait. Please provide me with the trail of all his ranting and raving.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega View Post
Do we know if the winner learns to be a good mod? We can't be sure, but that goes for either candidate. I don't see where Dagger showed a superior learning ability compared to Crock or Coco. But you already stated that Coco is a good candidate and Dagger may not have a chance after the election. Well, if he's out of question, maybe there are reasons for it?
Actually, I think he would make a good mod but I don't think he makes a good candidate. Two different things. Coco is actually a terrible candidate because he would have been a mod in waiting without the election and the idea behind this election is to chose someone who the Board might not have considered AT THIS MOMENT (for all of the guys who keep misinterpreting what I'm saying as DD would never become a mod if he lost this election).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega View Post
I for one will be voting for who I think would make the best mod, and that's Coco.
Feel free, nice to see that he's getting some love from the demographic his party went out of their way to insult!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartie View Post
Well form what I've seen form this Dagger dude, I can say that he is probably not a good one for Wrestling mod, as most of his wrestling posts are long and boring, and from reading the debates I can tell that his plans for the section isn't gonna turn into anything worthy.

The other two strike me as a type of poster that I do not exactly care for. I mean I'm not an active member at all and I usually only read what other people have to say (write) ,And If I'm not making a mistake these two guys sometimes fill threads with a lot of personal stuff which doesn't interest me because I see this forum as somewhat of a public place, not some place to buddy up and chitchat, so I don't want them as a mod too.

But If had to choose one, I'd go with Coco, as he will be in a section that a mod won't mean shit.
Brilliant, another guy from the apparent 'ABC cast' who is voting DFP... maybe Dagger forgot to rep them to get them onside

Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Jerry Lawler View Post
I forgot I was a part of the ABC Party.
Don't worry, we haven't forgotten you prodigal. Come back to the fold, Little Black Sheep - the fatted calf is prepped and primed!
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Old 01-06-2012, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FitFinlay4Life View Post
Outside of the infamous 'game' thread, I still haven't seen any evidence of this being a character trait. Please provide me with the trail of all his ranting and raving.
Besides the game thread there was that faggot thing, a lot of reporting of posts that weren't against the rules (I guess personal dislike was the reason, or misunderstanding of the rules which wouldn't be better) and generally getting too worked up over critique (not going to search trough 5,000 posts now). I have no personal problem with him. But I can just judge from what I've seen and I have the impression that certain things get too much under his skin, especially compared to the other candidates.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FitFinlay4Life View Post
Feel free, nice to see that he's getting some love from the demographic his party went out of their way to insult!
What do you mean?
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