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Old 06-28-2013, 11:15 AM
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Default The Friendzone And Nice Guy Syndrome: Who's the Douche?

So, the lady friend and I were talking about a guy... friend of hers, shall we say, who's been pining over her, in spite of the fact that he knows she's in a committed relationship. So, as he recounts it now, he's in the friendzone, because he was too nice a guy.

Really short and sweet:

1. Can you be too "nice" when you're courting someone.

2. What are your thoughts on the "friendzone"?
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Last edited by Con T. : 06-28-2013 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:25 AM
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I am going to get in here before this thread turns into a discussion about whether the "Friend Zone" actually exists except for in the mind of the "nice guy."

This guy does not sound like he is in the Friend Zone at all.

He sounds more like an arsehole who your friend should be kept away from. Bitterness does not belong in the "nice guy" and the fact that she knows he is pining over her suggests that he is not a true "nice guy" because the "nice guys" keep it hidden so well that the girl does not know she is being sought after by someone she just considers a friend.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:31 AM
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But is that all men who claim to exist in the "friend zone"?

Because, to me, it shouldn't be seen as a punishment that you're friends with a person. Like the person is choosing to hurt you.

Bitch, please. Maybe she just wants to be friends.

Personally, I think if you're using the friend zone as an excuse, you probably have a hundred different problems you need to address, before being too "nice"
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:44 AM
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That is essentially what I was getting at.

The Friend Zone is a creation of those who do not get what - or should that be "whom" - they want. It is an inherently negative idea in that friendship is all you are going to get from this girl, despite you wanting more. For me, for it to fall into the Friend Zone idea, the girl also should not know about the interest for if she is conscious of your interest but chooses not to reciprocate, you are not being Friend Zoned - you are being rejected.

However, I do think you can be too "nice", as in you do not want to take the chance of ruining the friendship you have made with a girl by attempting to take it further. You'd rather continue being friends with the girl rather than take the chance of getting what you want. This is what I see as the Friend Zone/Nice Guy combo.

You could call it some form of cowardly too though.
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Old 06-28-2013, 12:19 PM
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I don’t know if the friend zone is a real thing but I think being too nice can hurt when courting someone. If someone is too nice they can be perceived as trying too hard which can be perceived as desperation. Desperation is a turn off. Unfortunately for the nice guy sometimes his niceness is genuine but is mistaken for weakness. The key if to have confidence in yourself. A lot of nice guys don’t have confidence. If you have true confidence in yourself others can recognize that. A confident guy is not a desperate guy.
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Old 06-28-2013, 12:23 PM
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There's no such thing as being too nice. If someone tells you they're in the friend zone for being too nice then what they really mean is that they're too much of a pussy to be direct and decisive with the person they're attracted to.

Before I got married, I was in the friend zone multiple times, but my stays were only brief. If a woman tells you that she only sees you as a friend/will never feel the way that you feel about her, then you man the fuck up and tell her that you aren't going to settle for just being friends. One of two things will happen: A) she'll love the fact that you know what you want and she'll see the prospect of losing you as a friend as worse than the prospect of fucking you (AKA you're in, don't fuck it up) or B) her feelings won't change and you'll no longer have her in your life (which, let's face it, is better than pining over her while she fucks other people).

As for your girlfriend, I'd level with her on this one since it sounds like a classic case of the back pocket boyfriend (i.e. a guy she's keeping around just in case things go south with you and her).
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Old 06-28-2013, 01:02 PM
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My wife and I have been on again off again pretty much our whole lives. We have gone separate ways and seen other people, but we always seemed to come back to each other until we ended up getting married. Now we were friends in the beginning, but there was always an attraction. I think it all boils down to that. Attraction. I think the opposite of what others have stated here. I think the "friendzone" was created by the girl who is not attracted to the guy. It is an easy way for them to tell the guy that they are not attracted to them but can still benefit from the guys niceness. Now if you are that guy then it is time to get the hell away from that girl. There can't be a worse feeling than to be catering to a girl who is constantly sleeping with someone else. There is nothing wrong with being nice, but I think the niceness should end when you are doing doing doing doing for the girl and every night she spends with another guy. I think that is where the guy becomes the douche. Like I said though if there is no attraction then it doesn't matter what the nice guys does. It will never work out.
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Old 06-28-2013, 08:35 PM
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The Friend Zone can be very fickle. It can also be easily avoided. The first thing that needs to happen is an open and honest relationship. A woman knows within a few seconds whether or not she's attracted to someone - male or female - and there's very little a guy can do to sway her attraction other than being attractive to that woman right away. Women rarely 'come around' and realize they've made a mistake. They'd rather stay with a jerk and get beaten for looking cross-eyed than to admit they made a mistake and should have gave you a chance. That's how stupid most women are.

If a woman says she only wants to be friends and she doesn't 'feel the same way that you do', then you have to be totally up front with her about how you feel and whether it's a deal breaker in the friendship. Don't pussy-foot around and act like it's no big deal. Let her know how the feelings are. If it's purely sexual feelings, let her know you think she's hot and you want to escalate the relationship. Either way, be honest. Don't think she'll come around. She will not.

To be honest, I've been in the friend zone a few times and it felt demeaning. I usually ended up lashing out at the woman because - in my mind - she's too stupid to know what she has with me. The thing is, the moment there's feelings that exceed friendship is the moment it needs brought up. Don't bring it up when a dude walks out of bedroom after satisfying her sexually. Bring it up before she has the chance to get in that spot. Let her know there's feelings involved and it's more than friendship. If she says she doesn't feel that way and never will, let her know that a friendship may not be possible and you want to see if something can go further. If she's a TRUE friend, she'll be open to a date.

The only thing is to be yourself. If you're trying to be what you THINK she wants, you end up looking foolish and hating yourself and possible hating her for making you do such a thing.

And there's a difference in 'nice guys' and 'good guys'. Sometimes, a good guy gets in fights or does something stupid. A 'nice guy' doesn't have the guts to do anything that may upset the balance in the relationship. A woman respects a guy who's independent, assertive, shows a tinge of jealousy, and can physically protect them. Even short guys can do this. Just don't try to hide who you are. If you do that, you'll be found out and she will hate you and if she has girlfriends, she'll tell them. And they'll tell their girlfriends. And so on and so on.
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
1. Can you be too "nice" when you're courting someone.
Well, for some girls you can. Some girls see that "nice" as a sign that you have no spine at all. In other words, they would like you to be "The Man".

And from what I understanded in some of the talkings with the girls about that subject its not very hard to do it. You just have to show that you cant be stomped by everyone or in other words "not be a sissy". And lets face it, its not bad thing to look in a male because sheneeds a man who could stand for himself. From what I understand, thats all it takes...

Problem is, girl sometimes overact in that. So you get that extreme situation where she would rather date some jerk guy that decent nice guy. All because they think that being nice excludes you from being "The Man". And thats not true at all...

Quote:
2. What are your thoughts on the "friendzone"?
Well it happens. But my thoughts are that usually its not being nice its the problem but the fact that you dont come clean about intentions in time. And by the time you come clean she sees you as friend. If you start as friends and develope that kind of relationship its not that simple to just like that be more then friends...
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. J. O'Material View Post
So, the lady friend and I were talking about a guy... friend of hers, shall we say, who's been pining over her, in spite of the fact that he knows she's in a committed relationship. So, as he recounts it now, he's in the friendzone, because he was too nice a guy.
As he recounts it to you, or to her? Further, how nice of a guy could he be if he were pining for her and pursuing her actively, regardless of 'how nice' he was, if he was, if he knew she was in a committed relationship? That behavior, when interested in someone, is indicative to me of someone who's trying to steal said female away, showing how he's 'nicer and kinder and more supportive' then her current male companion.

Quote:
1. Can you be too "nice" when you're courting someone?
Regarding be 'too nice', it's a tricky one. If a man is 'too nice' to a woman, he can come across as needy, clingy, or simply not be what a woman prefers1'm not even sure if the word I'm looking for is 'nice', per se, as most women, especially as you get older, like nice.

At the same time, some women do like men who have an edge to them. Depending on the age, that woman may want to show independence and not rely on the man in some ways. Most women, despite popular view, do want to be treated well, with kindness and respect. But yes, you can be too nice when courting someone, its an easy way to be strung along and take advantage of.

I was, and still am, extremely kind and respectful to my now wife of almost five years. But I also was on guard, and never let her take advantage of me.

So if someone is "too nice" in that they let the person they're pursuing, without reciprocation, take advantage of them, that person may lose respect for them and take advantage. The 'good person' would either let them go early if not interested, or tell them to freaking relax around them, be themselves, and let things progress.

As for the friend zone, it's hard to stay there long. I can understand, in a way, I suppose, men who have genuine interest in a "taken" woman. It's forbidden, which often, makes the woman either more desirable . In the end, something has to change, however. Someone is going to be unhappy with current circumstances, be it the person 'pining' for the other, or the person being pined for, and it never ends well.
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