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  #11  
Old 12-29-2017, 07:34 PM
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So with all that said, did you enjoy Goldberg's comeback?
Yes I did. It just felt big no matter what he has done. I mean, just look at that entrance



He just showed up for the match and he is more over then 95% of roster. Call it nostalgia, call it whatever you want, but that is something that you can build on and WWE was smart to invest into that. I mean, sure, Survivor Series+ Fastlane are less then 2 minutes together but he gave us kinda enjoyable Wrestlemania match. And now if he comes back he could, for example be credible to lose to Braun, Reigns or anybody else and it would feel bigger.
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  #12  
Old 12-30-2017, 12:30 AM
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lol to all you who claim Goldberg devalued anything let me remind you that ol Bill actually was given the belt to give it a much needed shot in the arm, a shot of prestige because thats something the current generation sorely lacks. Its no coincidence that they guys back in the 80s/ late 90s could draw and get crazy fans based on their character; each and every one of them were important to SOMEbody and you dont see that in wrestling today; wether its management interference or these guys just aren't as charismatic is a argument for another time but end result is that these guys cant draw in the crowds and more importantly they cant draw the interest in the product so Vince is more than justified in bringing in the old timers to spike ratings and TRY to get a good rub for the new guys. The Universal belt NEEDED Bill
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  #13  
Old 12-30-2017, 03:19 AM
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Yes cause it was a reminder of what it was like to have a true megastar on the roster again. Goldberg didn't feel like anyone else on the roster and that includes John Cena cause Goldberg actually had star written all over him. He carried himself, walked, talked, acted and competed like a star. He felt real and like a hero unlike the rest of the roster. He was the most exciting thing WWE had in ages. He was more over than anybody on the roster and that's saying plenty.

2017 Goldberg felt more like WCW Goldberg than 2003 Goldberg did.

As for Kevin Owens' reign, it wasn't anything special, so I didn't care that he lost it to a bigger star who likely added more credibility and prestige to the belt than Owens ever did. Goldberg-Brock turned out better than Owens-Jericho at WM, so the Universal Title was on the line in the right match.

Wish they had did more with Goldberg/Taker. Wanted to see Goldberg vs. Taker at Wrestlemania.

I wouldn't mind if Goldberg had another run with WWE.

Last edited by Wolf Pac : 12-30-2017 at 03:39 AM.
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  #14  
Old 12-30-2017, 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by relentless1 View Post
lol to all you who claim Goldberg devalued anything let me remind you that ol Bill actually was given the belt to give it a much needed shot in the arm, a shot of prestige because thats something the current generation sorely lacks. Its no coincidence that they guys back in the 80s/ late 90s could draw and get crazy fans based on their character; each and every one of them were important to SOMEbody and you dont see that in wrestling today; wether its management interference or these guys just aren't as charismatic is a argument for another time but end result is that these guys cant draw in the crowds and more importantly they cant draw the interest in the product so Vince is more than justified in bringing in the old timers to spike ratings and TRY to get a good rub for the new guys. The Universal belt NEEDED Bill
I agree they wouldn't need the part timers if the current group could draw, Also Goldberg to me looks like a wrestling champion, Kevin Owens looks like a guy who works as a mechanic in my local garage, Same with guys like Finn Balor I feel like I could have a chance at beating those guys in a legitimate match for the world title but someone like Goldberg or even Brock I feel like I wouldn't last 5 seconds with.
I enjoyed his comeback and would have prefered to see him a little longer but I knew from the begining that it wasn't a long term return.
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  #15  
Old 12-31-2017, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Jack-Hammer View Post
I utterly despised Goldberg's comeback for a number of reasons. First and foremost, Goldberg couldn't wrestle and when you get right down to it, he never really could. Eric Bischoff knew how limited Goldberg was and was able to brilliantly hide his limitations by keeping the vast majority of his matches under 2 or 3 minutes with most of his opponents being outright jobbers or low card members of the roster. The long term effect of that turned out that Goldberg's streak was vastly overrated and hyped into being something it wasn't and that Goldberg himself was some phenomenal talent.

Goldberg's return further highlighted some massively fundamental flaws in Vince McMahon's decision making: he was, to some degree, sacrificing WWE's long term stability over the nostalgic spectacle of older wrestlers going at it who aren't a fraction of what they once were. Goldberg was one of the biggest examples of Vince using modern guys, guys who should be the focus of his company as they're the ones who actually carry it, as fodder for 2000s and Attitude Era stars. We'd already seen it for years: Stone Cold popping up every so often for a promo segment, he gets into something with a modern guy, winds up hitting the Stone Cold Stunner and poses around the ring while pouring beer all over himself or the Rock making trained monkeys out of Daniel Bryan, Rusev, the Wyatt Family, etc. all for the sake of nostalgia rather than using these mega names to actually help build up these younger wrestlers. And now, there are reports that Batista might be coming back for another run and if he does, I'd be willing to bet that he has it written into the contract that he's truly there to be a 100% TOP level guy; no putting over young guys this time around. WrestleMania looks to have become the haven for the part timer looking to be in the spotlight and collect a massive paycheck. Based on how the lay of the land in WWE looks as of right now, we can expect matches featuring Triple H, John Cena, Randy Orton, Brock Lesnar, Kurt Angle, POSSIBLY the Undertaker and POSSIBLY Batista; at least half the fucking card will be made up of part timers who'll be the focus of the show while Vince McMahon is inexplicably in the dark about how WWE just isn't really cool anymore.

If you're an older fan in your 30s, 40s or even 50s and you hear a fan in their 10s and 20s say how many top guys today don't stack up to the top guys of 20 years go, how they've been sacrificed to the part timers and nostalgia acts is one of the top reasons why.
As much as I enjoyed the nostalgia pop that the Goldberg return had, I have to agree with most of what you are saying.

It's been a reoccurring theme in WWE over the last 10 or so years. Vince still leaning to heavily on the massive stars of the AE and early 2000's but, I believe, at the expense of building current stars today.


However, I believe, if done right there can be a happy medium.

For example, John Cena vs The Rock (the first time), and if it wasn't billed "Once in a Lifetime" I would have accepted the 2nd match a little more easily. But the first match was a good idea. The Rock was hot, big blockbuster movie star and John Cena was the main guy in WWE. The match pretty much sold itself. And what was the best part? It WAS NOT for the WWE Title. Because it didn't need to be.

Same way I think Goldberg's return could have been better, actually, if it was NOT for the WWE Title against Brock Lesnar. Sure, it probably would have got top billing on the card over whatever WWE title match went on like the Cena vs Rock situation but at least the WWE title match would be contended by current WWE stars not age-old ones.

Even the Sting return was pretty cool, of course I don't agree at all with the booking of his WrestleMania match. He should have matched up vs The Undertaker and then if he lost that match to 'Taker it would have been still a great WrestleMania moment and acceptable. But Sting losing to Triple H over some garbage with DX coming down and NWO helping Sting which they notoriously didn't do in WCW was just misguided. But let's say in the Sting return; he returned, built a non-title storyline towards a match at WM against Taker or Triple H and then either lost to Taker or beat Triple H and then rode off into the sunset ... that would have been perfect!


Because the truth of the matter is even if these former massive stars come back to WWE and do draw a bit more viewers and PPV buys, it still never lasts long and goes away once they go away or, even, if they stay too long and have worn out their welcome. It shows you that nostalgia acts are OK, but in moderation and they should not be at the expense of current stars.

Now, the whole build up to Raw 1000 with Heath Slater (jobber-extraordinaire) making various former Raw stars look great was actually really fun. That, I believe, was done perfectly. It gave the fans a great nostalgia pop, and hey, Slater even got to win one match (against Doink!) and it was NOT at the expense of a current WWE star who had all sorts of main event potential (sorry Heath, but he does great at what he does).


WWE has had a wishy-washy track record of bringing back legends, sometimes done really well, sometimes not.

WWE brought back New Age Outlaws a few years ago, I believe a main feud was against The Shield, it was actually pretty cool and you could tell it was done to boost the CURRENT WWE stars.

However, not long ago The Dudley Boyz came back and while their pop was huge and the initial buzz once they returned was good, the rest of their time wasn't all that memorable, at that's a problem if you bring back stars. I think they feuded with Enzo & Cass and I think Enzo & Cass won but the details are not clear, and they SHOULD be, it should have been a VERY memorable moment if Cass & Enzo won. Then after that D-boys did not much else until there was nothing left for them to do.

Now we have Hardy Boyz back and yes, their WM return was at the expense of current stars but we now know it wasn't just a one-off thing like that joke of a segment with Rock vs Wyatt Family. Hardys were back full-time and ready to go. They had some good matches and LOST the Tag Titles to help build up current stars and now Matt Hardy gets to try out the Broken Hardy gimmick which, at the very least, should be MEMORABLE, and that should be the point. Why do anything if it won't be memorable?


So to sum it up:


- I thought the Goldberg return was pretty cool, the first match back was a cool surprise and the RR. But, wasn't a fan of Goldberg vs Brock being for the title. The match did redeem their previous poor WM match.

- There should be a happy medium in WWE between nostalgia acts, moments and returns and still pushing current talent to be stars

- WWE has had some success finding the balance, but I believe have also, at times, over done it and it has cost their current stars and the company more current long-term success

- So the result? Don't STOP having past stars come back but try not to do it at the expense of current talent that could or should be built to be main event stars.
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  #16  
Old 12-31-2017, 04:34 PM
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John Cena said it best during his promo with Reigns and it really stands true to what Rock, Austin, Goldberg, Sting or any of the older mega stars could have said in a promo. “I’m here because you can’t Do your damn job.” Say what you want about the older stars but they put butts in seats. A J Styles also said it best during a stone cold podcast when he said they give you an opportunity to be something, but it’s my job and my job only to get over with the fans. Goldberg’s comeback was an absolute success.
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  #17  
Old 01-01-2018, 11:36 AM
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Loved every minute of it. Goldberg looked to be in better shape than most on the active roster. His match against Lesnar at Survivor Series was proof that, despite how much we criticize the WWE, they can still pull a fast one on us. Pun intended. I can understand the argument of adding the Universal Championship into the mix with himself and Lesnar, as not needed, but it was only done for the long haul. Moving forward, the Universal Championship is going to be the premier championship, so having the history of Goldberg vs Lesnar at Wrestlemania for it, only helps it out. Kevin Owens still has many more years to wrestle for that title at WrestleMania. Also, him versus Jericho for that title wouldn't have been as stellar as people are trying to make it out to be, although I'm totally understanding of the opinion. Goldberg coming back and completely owning it, was only 2nd to the Hulk Hogan revival in the early 2000s, for me. It was that good and Goldberg was surprisingly in peak condition. Also, it was cool how it was so personal to him as a human being. To see him finally share his glory with his son and his wife, was really awesome. Good for Goldberg on that one.
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  #18  
Old 02-20-2018, 09:40 AM
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I was about to post a thread about whether or not Goldberg beating Lesnar was a good desicion, now that we're 1 year away from that, but I guess this thread is a nice fit to leave my opinion.

I also had mixed feeling about this, mainly because of the fact that Goldberg came back and squashed Lesnar in a minute. This of course led to an awesome done-right match between them at Wrestlemania. I still believe that Lesnar should have done more damage to Goldberg at Mania though, like make him tap out and win the match via KO, instead of just pinning him. THAT, would have done justice to Brock's squash loss.

There are things that I would have booked differently in this entire angle. Mainly book Goldberg to win the championship at the Rumble and Lesnar to win the Rumble, because the way Lesnar challenged Goldberg at Wrestlemania was just stupid. Then have Goldberg get a successful title defense at Fast Lane. Anyway.

Goldberg seemed to have a lot of fun this time around. This comeback saved his legacy and left us with a good taste in our mouths, so I guess mission accomplished. Goldberg seems like a genuine nice human being and someone who loves his family and the fans, so he really deserved a better exit than the one he got in 2004. And hey, the fans loved him this time around. Nobody expected Goldberg to get that over and become the hottest thing in 2016-17, so I guess, mission accomplished.

I wouldn't mind Goldberg coming back for one last match, in order to put over a young talent like Strowman.

So, summing up, yeah I think I liked it. His return definately lived up to the hype and exceeded expectations.

PS: The fact that all of this was Lesnar's idea is astonishing. The man smells cash from miles away.
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  #19  
Old 02-20-2018, 07:15 PM
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The issue isn't so much recycling the Attitude Era or relying on past names... it's been using those names in a different context to how they got over.

Goldberg worked better than other comebacks/nostalgia acts because he wasn't a character rooted in the Attitude Era and TV-14... he was WCW at their most kid friendly and WWE when it was well on the way back to PG. When DX/Outlaws for example have returned, it's always watered down.

It was never going to be good the moment Road Dog said "You'd better call..." not "your ass better call..." the fans who loved that rebellious streak were let down, and that mean the newer fans didn't "get" why they were good.

Having Goldberg beat Brock as he did made sense, he was pretty much the only guy who could ever do that, short of Warrior ever having that last match but it would scream "fake"... Goldberg was in good enough shape that it looked like he could beat Brock like that.

It's an interesting way to look at using talents who return, Jarrett being the next who could come back. I'd have no problem with it if he was in a short feud with Elias, but only if they're breaking guitars over each other's heads and he's using the "Don't Piss Me Off..." gimmick... anything else will purely suck.

As for Goldberg, let him retire... his kid got to see him win the title and beat Brock... it really isn't going to get better than that other than the HOF ceremony. There's nothing in it for Goldberg to "put Braun" or anyone else over and he was always the guy whom "it was never about money" for, or he'd have been back years ago.

Last edited by THTRobtaylor : 02-20-2018 at 07:17 PM.
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  #20  
Old 03-06-2018, 03:08 AM
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I would enjoy him turning up out of nowhere and speaking Lesnar, gifting Reigns the title. If Miz can beat Reigns with a roll up, how can we believe he can pin Lesnar without interference. Goldberg is being inducted that weekend to the HOF, be a nice little nod to last year
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