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  #21  
Old 11-23-2015, 07:01 AM
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If Taker would have left the WWE during the Monday Night wars - yes it would have been a major loss to WWE.... but the likes of JBL are over exaggerating by saying the WWE would have gone under.

Bret Hart left the WWE in 1997.... in hindsight the company actually prospered after he departed (despite the WWE lacking in star names at the time) thanks to a certain Mr Austin.
When Bret left the WWE he had been a bigger star than Taker and the WWE's franchise player more or less from 1992-97 (aside from his 8 month break in 1996). Leading into Survivor Series- Bret, Shawn and Austin were arguably the 3 biggest stars in the company.

Taker has been a major star for the WWE for 25 years.... but its his longevity that really cements his legacy. There hasn't been any point in time when Taker was the top superstar on the roster... he has usually hovered as the #3 or #4 guy.
Early 90s Hogan and Warrior. Mid 90s Bret and Shawn. Attitude era- Austin, Rock, Foley.... and into the 2000s- Cena, Triple H.... and with Taker winding down with age... Bryan, Punk, Cena, Orton have carried the company in more recent times.

I read earlier in this thread that Taker was the guy to be chasing the title rather than the guy who has long title reigns... which is spot on.
He is a major attraction with a unique gimmick and deserves his legendary status.... however when people talk about him being the greatest star ever- they quickly forget what Hogan, Austin, Rock did for the WWE on a mainstream level. Major WWE boom periods conincided with those guys making wrestling cool again.
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  #22  
Old 11-23-2015, 07:27 AM
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For as long as I've been watching which is basically all my life ,starting in the late 90's, Undertaker has always been in a title feud or one of the top 3 programs on the shows he was on. I think that certainly would make him important because for the 17 year I saw him he was always one of the biggest names and from the looks of his main events and wins before I started watching he was a main character then too. Thinking year to year from say 98 (when he stopped winning world titles regularly) to now, I can't find a year where he wasn't in a top or important program. 98 he main evented with Austin several times. 99 Ministry of Darkness 00 he became Biker Taker and was in the top 1 or 2 program all year. 01 he was an integral part of the invasion 02 was WWE champ 03 his Lesnar feud again 04-10 he was either the #1 or #2 face on Smackdown that entire time. Then 11-now is Streak taker where he's the huge legendary star.

To make a comparison to Dragon Ball and DBZ, Taker was never a Goku or the main character but he was more like Piccolo for as long as he was around was always an important, integral, and relevant character and without Piccolo many things would have turned out differently but the top story May have been the same if this makes sense.
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  #23  
Old 12-05-2015, 08:40 PM
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Complete disrespect towards the Undertaker on here.

Summerslam '98 doesn't draw 700,000 buys without him in the main event and that's a fact.

Last edited by SCrooked1 : 12-05-2015 at 08:44 PM.
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  #24  
Old 12-06-2015, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by SCrooked1 View Post
Complete disrespect towards the Undertaker on here.

Summerslam '98 doesn't draw 700,000 buys without him in the main event and that's a fact.
lol, even if that were true and I say Austin got the buys not Taker, thats one PPV from one year. Stop drinking the WWE koolaid, UT isn't that important to the overall success to WWE as you might think.
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  #25  
Old 12-06-2015, 02:43 AM
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The Undertaker has always been in the main/co-main event scene.
WWE survived the loss of bret hart coz he was old. Vince realized he'd be taking more money than he'd make for the company which is exactly what bret did in WCW.
Now imagine a young phenom leaving the WWF. Vince loses money WCW gets a new attraction.
Now imagine the WWE roster without taker feuding with all the top dogs. Would they be considered that great had they not beaten the Deadman.
He and kane added an extra tier to the roster.
Jerico in one of his interviews said vince only cared about what the top guys were doing. You can believe taker was always one of them.
At one point before, The Great One took over, more people knew The Undertaker than anyone in WWE. He was very important and he made tons of money. But whether WWE would have survived without him is anyone's guess.
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  #26  
Old 12-06-2015, 04:48 AM
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Originally Posted by yourdamnluck View Post
The Undertaker has always been in the main/co-main event scene.
WWE survived the loss of bret hart coz he was old. Vince realized he'd be taking more money than he'd make for the company which is exactly what bret did in WCW.
Now imagine a young phenom leaving the WWF. Vince loses money WCW gets a new attraction.
Now imagine the WWE roster without taker feuding with all the top dogs. Would they be considered that great had they not beaten the Deadman.
He and kane added an extra tier to the roster.
Jerico in one of his interviews said vince only cared about what the top guys were doing. You can believe taker was always one of them.
At one point before, The Great One took over, more people knew The Undertaker than anyone in WWE. He was very important and he made tons of money. But whether WWE would have survived without him is anyone's guess.
lol you really believe that Bret hart was much older than the Undertaker? take off the WWE blindfold man, Taker isn't even in the same league as Bret and Shawn, much less Hogan and Austin.
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  #27  
Old 12-06-2015, 05:26 AM
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Originally Posted by relentless1 View Post
lol, even if that were true and I say Austin got the buys not Taker, thats one PPV from one year. Stop drinking the WWE koolaid, UT isn't that important to the overall success to WWE as you might think.
What's so "lol" about it? Undertaker was the only other established star at that point, to say he had nothing to do with that buyrate is beyond ludicrous.

Undertaker is the reason that Kane got over and still exists today, he was the first heel that didn't have the traditional heel characteristics (acting like a coward and insulting the fans) and was the first babyface that didn't have the traditional face characteristics (slapping hands with fans or acknowledging them). He clearly did have an impact on the wrestling world man.

Last edited by SCrooked1 : 12-06-2015 at 05:39 AM.
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  #28  
Old 12-06-2015, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by I Am Phenom View Post
First, and this is arguable, there wouldn’t have been a Mankind and by extension there wouldn’t have been Cactus Jack, Dude Love, or Mick Foley. Sure, Mankind may have still been introduced, however, would he have gotten over as well as he did when he debuted if there was no Undertaker?
There's no way to know. Mankind would have had to develop differently had Undertaker not been there as an ideal opponent to get him started, yet Mick Foley wasn't hired just to give 'Taker something else to do; Foley was brought in for his hardcore prowess.....and it's possible he could have become even bigger had 'Taker jumped.....or not.

But yes, Undertaker was important to WWE. He filled a special role through the years, one that the company felt they couldn't do without. The thing is, overexposing Mark Calaway and his gimmick in the way they used Bret Hart and Steve Austin would have worn out the mystery of Undertaker. Sure, he was used a lot more than he is today, but installing him as world champion for any length of time would have ruined his mystique for the fans, causing them to regard him as just another good wrestler.

Even today, that he performs less because of age and injury is logical and good. It gives a 'special added attraction' asset to PPVs when he shows up, as if he's a star from a different sports entertainment organization coming in to perform a single match for WWE. Things are just as they should be.

Through the years, we could always depend on guys like Hart, Austin, Michaels & Cena to do the heavy, constant work......while the appearance of Undertaker was a widely anticipated event to look forward to.

It's been 25 years well-spent, for him & us.
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  #29  
Old 12-07-2015, 04:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCrooked1 View Post
What's so "lol" about it? Undertaker was the only other established star at that point, to say he had nothing to do with that buyrate is beyond ludicrous.

Undertaker is the reason that Kane got over and still exists today, he was the first heel that didn't have the traditional heel characteristics (acting like a coward and insulting the fans) and was the first babyface that didn't have the traditional face characteristics (slapping hands with fans or acknowledging them). He clearly did have an impact on the wrestling world man.
The WWF could have filled Summerslam with ANYBODY against Austin and it would have sold out, Stone Cold was white hot in the summer of '98.

And Taker wasn't the first aggressive heel; Jake the Snake and Roddy Piper were "cool" heels long before Undertaker came onto the scene and theres been many strong silent type monster heels before Undertaker as well.

I give Mark Calloway kudos for being one of the longest tenured wrestlers and being able to make that gimmick work for as long as he has but to say he's in the upper echelon of the all time greats isn't accurate. In my opinion and from what top carrying stars are he's not even in the second tier tbh, he was never the centrepiece of the WWF/E even though he was a great attraction nothing was ever truly built around him as far as the main event scene in the WWF is concerned. Keep believing the hype bro but deep down you can't deny the truth: Undertaker was a good wrestler and a great gimmick but he has never ever been "the" guy and that just doesnt make him all that important to the WWF/E overall.
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