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  #11  
Old 11-12-2015, 03:19 PM
FlairFan2003 FlairFan2003 is offline
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Originally Posted by Dirk View Post
This is my take on it. Feel free to disagree, of course.

As a wrestling booker, you want your crowd to play along, otherwise the story is fucked, or at least semi-fucked. Since we know that the death of kayfabe along with the Outsiders ruined the face/heel dynamic, it's no longer about who was the better man/woman/third option on the night, but who is cooler, hotter or bearing a stronger resemblance to various traditions' messianic figures.

Okay... So it's not the good guy versus the bad guy anymore, it's my guy versus the other guy. This is the single greatest challenge that they didn't have in the past. People don't accept results anymore, because it's not "my hero lost " anymore, it's "fucking Vince is burying my favourite rookie!!!1!11!".

Not having the crowd play along means the good 9.95$-paying folks at home will have a smaller chance of playing ball as well, snowballing into more and more split crowds, snowballing into worse TV-crowds, etc..

So, from a promoter's perspective, if you want the crowd to play along, you either have to:
1) Treat all your regulars as faces and have them squash only local jobbers for all eternity with no big matches ever.
2) Pipe in the noise and edit Smackdown in post-production.
3) Go back in time to the first fucker who dared cheer for the Macho Man at Wrestlemania 5 and shoot him in the throat before it happens.

I do believe that the WWE chose the lesser of the evils. As much as it is an insult to the fans by muting them and manipulating their noise, it's just as bad cheering for an urn-stealing son of a bitch against Undy at WM 29.

Crowd noise editing or not you can tell when a crowd "isn't buying" someone, or when a crowd really likes the character they are supposed to hate. WWE didn't envision Steve Austin as a face, he never played a face and in fact had played a very credible heel most of his career, fans just loved his persona so much they cheered anyway and WWE was forced to book him almost exclusively against heels. make him more sympathetic towards good guys, and enhance his character as "anti authority" only against abusive authority. At the same time WCW couldn't book Ric Flair as a heel no matter what he did because the older audience loved his work ethic and dedication over decades of his career while the newer audience thought the suits, women, bling etc was "cool". He was cheered almost no matter what. You could have edited crowd noise as much as you wanted but you couldn't have hid those facts.

There are other examples, Daniel Bryan being a recent one where he couldn't be buried as a nobody no matter how hard WWE may have tried and The Road Warriors becoming mega faces when they were conceived and originally played as biker villains from Hell as an older one, along with numerous others.
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  #12  
Old 11-13-2015, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Ding_Dong_#2 View Post
I’ve lived through David Arquette, The Gobbeldygooker, The Montreal Screwjob, Papa Shango, The “murder” of Paul Bearer, Mae Young’s baby, David Sammartino’s phantom submission match, Katie Vick and much, much more.

Its entertainment, we all know that – that means that you are going to have some duff moments, duff storylines, and some duff characters throughout the years; you wince one week and cheer the next, that’s how it has always been.

But editing crowd noise? Fans and the IWC pay good money to watch wrestling either at home or in various stadia – they have a right, a sincere right, as any sports crowd who have parted with their hard-earned dollars, to an opinion and have a right to express it in any legal way that they see fit. Wrestling organizations create “Superstars” – they ask you to build them up, and when they knock them down, they ask you to support someone else; that is fine, it is a business after all and they believe in what is “best for business”.

But “ask” is the key word here – that is all it should be, a request to support those that they have invested a lot of time and money into. Sometimes, as we all know, people think differently; people like Daniel Bryan and CM Punk would arguably have never got the pushes they did without vehement online support and at the events - this almost forces them into a situation which they loathe, a situation where the fans are telling them that they believe something different to what they are being spoon-fed every week.
Crowd reactions and noises have been responsible for some of the greatest moments in wrestling history – Bruno losing to Superstar Graham, Hogan slamming Andre, CM Punk’s pipe bomb and the aftermath, Undertaker’s streak being defeated and every Monday Night Raw after Wrestlemania. If they alter what we say, then I personally feel used and manipulated – our cheers, boos and reactions are only good enough when you want them to be and it is unacceptable; you can’t compare professional wrestling to organized, professional sport but the principle is the same – it wouldn’t exist without the fans, it wouldn’t exist without is bankrolling them so we are more than entitled to have a voice, and to cheer/boo whoever we like at any volume we like.

I’ve been a fan for around 40 years now, and this situation has pushed me closer to turning my back on professional wrestling than anything else. Roman Reigns is clearly meant to be the next big thing, we all know that but if people don’t think so, then they have a right to make their voice heard at the events. If not, then why bother with crowd noise at all? Why not have it on tape?

I personally think that every fan should be completely silent at every event, show them that you can’t insult us and manipulate our reactions in this way – we deserve better, we pay your wages, we pay those that you “think” we should like and support. At the very least, we should be able to have our voice heard as I said.
The WWE are a big entertainment company trying to present a TV show the way they want it. If you don't like the way they are booking the shows and editing, why not try an alternative like Ring Of Honor (it's a smaller crowd but they are really into the matches) or New Japan (Japanese fans are more quiet and tend to applaud, rather than cheer).

Most people at events are there to have a good time but attending and sitting in silence or staging a form of protest will just spoil it for others, there are alot of kids at the shows who won't understand, maybe try and get a chant going for your favourite wrestler and see where it goes and hope like with DB, the noise gets too much for them to ignore or either just stop investing money into this form of entertainment and try something else or perhaps send a petition with lots of signatures to the WWE and see if they take note
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  #13  
Old 11-25-2015, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Mustang Sally View Post
A good example happened during Hulk Hogan's WWE Hall-of-Fame speech. Is there anyone that honestly believes the 'One more match!" chant just happened to occur by itself? Oh, come now.
To be honest, I think that's a bad example. Hogan is one of those guys who will have people pushing for a "last match" no matter how old and broken down he is. He has meant so much to alot of the older wrestling fans that I fully believe that chant was created by genuine fans rather than planned by WWE.

I'm sure the "planted" chanters does go on though, especially when WWE are trying to push a particular chant/gimmick on us to try and encourage other fans to join in.

Adding in crowd noise is nothing new though, it goes on in other sports too. In the English Premier League, Manchester City were mocked a few years ago for piping in crowd chanting and the sound of people singing City songs during a match , when the actual stadium was deathly silent.
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  #14  
Old 11-25-2015, 03:28 PM
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Yes it's insulting. Worse than the "applaud" signs at game show tapings
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  #15  
Old 11-25-2015, 06:43 PM
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It is insulting. I can see using it in the situation of heavy foul language if its for TV but the fans cheering or booing someone is just part of being a fan. The WWE has to roll with it and understand they can't force feed stuff anymore. The ECW type chants should have died with ECW as that's just the fans trying to take over. Put on a good show and don't insult the fans and problem solved
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