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  #1  
Old 08-11-2013, 09:30 AM
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Default Why Do People Complain About TNA Hiring WWE Guys When WWE Did the Same in the 90s?

Whenever a former WWE wrestler goes to TNA many people start complaining and saying "another WWE reject" etc.

But didn't WWE do the same in the 90s?

Wrestlers who WWE took from NWA/WCW :

"Stunning" Steve Austin
"Mean" Mark Callus (Undertaker)
Jean Paul Levesque (HHH)
Lex Luger
Sid Vicious (Sycho Sid)
Kevin Nash/Oz (Diesel)
Scott Hall/The Diamond Studd - (Razor Ramon)
Chris Jericho, Kane etc

WWF took most of the wrestlers from NWA/WCW except Rock (WWE's only homegrown star)

Wrestlers going back and forth between companies has been going on for decades. It's no different today, where if a wrestler has no work in WWE, or doesn't like working there they go to TNA...they have an option, so they take it.

Discuss.

Last edited by ProWrestlingFan : 08-11-2013 at 09:58 AM.
  #2  
Old 08-11-2013, 09:44 AM
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I'm pretty sure every wrestling company ever has taken on talent who used to work in rival promotions, so setting your aim at WWE in the 90's is a strange target. Also, I hadn't noticed people complaining about TNA "stealing" WWE talent, so much as taking WWE's table scraps and placing them in prominent roles. I don't think most reasonable people have an issue with TNA acquiring or utilizing former WWE Superstars. The problem many have is how those wrestlers are used, which is often in a way that puts them higher on the card seemingly just by the virtue that they used to work in WWE. A lot of folks just like to give TNA shit, though, and will do so for anything. Whatever the case may be, I don't think it's a big deal. The influx of MMA talent is the new mocking point.
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  #3  
Old 08-11-2013, 09:48 AM
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Hello thread from 2008!

Nobody says TNA "steals" wrestlers from WWE. Nobody has ever said that. Maybe people have said that TNA buy WWE "rejects". Which they do, it's true. If WWE don't want somebody and release them then they're WWE rejects. That doesn't mean TNA can't do something with them. Steve Austin = WCW reject. It happens.

However TNA hire WWE nobodies. I'm not on about an Anderson who must've seemed like a good signing at the time. More like Mike Knox, who never did anything in WWE or showed any reason why TNA would hire him and then push him. And others who escape me at this moment.

Anyway, it's 2013 and nobody cares anymore. Everybody excepts TNA is never going to improve so its a non-issue.
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  #4  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:25 AM
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Well people seem to be complaining about other things TNA do besides the hiring of former WWE talent.

But I'll bite anyway.

Its moreso the WWE fanboys (the ones who follow only WWE and don't appreciate any other form of wrestling) that say this, because they feel released WWE talent signed to another company are sub par (convienently forgetting about people like Steve Austin, Undertaker and Chris Jericho were the exact same in WCW). As IDR says all the time whenever these type of threads come up 'Talent is talent'

However as Jake said TNA do have a bad habit of signing nobodies. I'm not against signing a 'nobody' to build up to become something great (that would be awesome) but TNA has a habit of signing the ex WWE guys who don't have much going for them and don't show any signs of improvement like Knox, Doc/Gallows and others.

Back in the early days of TNA, signing guys like this wouldn't have been to bad, because they could do with anyone with a sembelance of name value (and to the lowest degree guys like Doc and Knox do) but where the company is now they've got guys like Sting, Jeff Hardy, Kurt Angle, Mr Anderson and The Dudleys, guys with big name value. Guys from the independents who have a following like Austin Aries, Samoa Joe, AJ Styles and Chris Sabin. They've got their own developmental place and Gut Check (even though its flawed) for new talent. Signing guys from WWE who's only name value comes from 'That guy who worked for WWE' and who haven't really shown much in terms of potential seems pointless.

If you're going to sign ex WWE guys, sign guys that have potential like John Morrison, Chris Masters or Trent Barretta.
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  #5  
Old 08-11-2013, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProWrestlingFan View Post
Whenever a former WWE wrestler goes to TNA many people start complaining and saying "another WWE reject" etc.

But didn't WWE do the same in the 90s?

Wrestlers who WWE took from NWA/WCW :

"Stunning" Steve Austin
"Mean" Mark Callus (Undertaker)
Jean Paul Levesque (HHH)
Lex Luger
Sid Vicious (Sycho Sid)
Kevin Nash/Oz (Diesel)
Scott Hall/The Diamond Studd - (Razor Ramon)
Chris Jericho, Kane etc

WWF took most of the wrestlers from NWA/WCW except Rock (WWE's only homegrown star)

Wrestlers going back and forth between companies has been going on for decades. It's no different today, where if a wrestler has no work in WWE, or doesn't like working there they go to TNA...they have an option, so they take it.

Discuss.

The issue is not TNA signing former WWE wrestlers. There are tons of talent on the indys that TNA could turn into TNA stars. Instead they rely on taking WWE's framework and just plug them into their own roster. Very few times has TNA repackaged the wrestler with a new gimmick.

The other issue is TNA is taking a mid-level or floundering former WWE superstar and putting them ahead of TNA's homegrown talent. They've got huge names in Hogan, Sting, Angle...and yet they're still pulling in the same ratings they were a few years ago. No amount of former WWE (or WCW) names will move that needle. They need to abandon picking up WWE's castoffs and start focusing on building a slate of talent that can be their own stars.
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  #6  
Old 08-11-2013, 11:58 AM
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It's a cheap argument, coated in words with negative connotations that has been spewed by people left and right for the last ten years and has been established through tireless repetition. It's something people associate with TNA while every single company has done it.

Whether it's stealing talent or hiring recently released talent, every single wrestling company has done it, does it and will continue to do it. There is nothing wrong with it and if companies weren't doing it then a lot of them would be in a very bad condition.

Wrestlers are employees at the end of the day. If your trade is marketing and you're working or a firm, once you are fired or you quit you go ahead and look for another job in marketing since that's what you're good at. You work for another firm which has a position for you where you can apply your marketing knowledge and skills.

Same with wrestlers. Once a wrestler stops working for WWE he looks for another wrestling company to work for. They negotiate a deal and the talent appears on the other show.

The only people who have a problem with this are common Internet morons who have nothing better to do than take a dump on TNA because it's the cool thing to do. Everyone loves TNA hate. Even when it's mindless and makes no sense.

If people have an issue with the fact that TNA is taking advantage of the popularity a wrestler has gained in another company and they have it all served to them on a silver platter then you've got a motive and you've got something against TNA which makes you unable to process this information correctly.

If TNA takes advantage of such a situation, such as they did with Jeff Hardy, it doesn't make them cheap, or lazy, or bush league. It just means they struck a great deal. They got a popular talent without having to spend years to build him or her up. It's a great deal. Why would that pass that up? So they wouldn't break the IWC moral code? Please. Moves like that should be praised, not made fun of.

TNA is good for wrestling. Wrestlers have somewhere to go once the WWE disappoints them, or they disappoint the WWE. It keeps a lot of guys in the business, it keeps them wrestling. No wrestlers - no wrestling. People shouldn't bitch about it, they should pray people keep circulating between WWE and TNA. It's healthy.
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  #7  
Old 08-11-2013, 12:04 PM
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I believe the issue isn't that they hire former WWE stars as much as it is the fact that they cater to former WWE guys over their own home grown talent. Many times a former WWE talent would spring board to the top while stars like AJ, Brown, or Joe would be pushed down. AJ Styles is a perfect example of someone who has suffered greatly from so many former WWE stars flooding TNA. His star has fallen. Same for Joe.

There was a time when someone could turn on TNA and see fresh young wrestlers pull off moves never seen before on American TV. But now we see Hogan & Ray having twenty minute promos. And I think the die hard wrestling fans know that TNA was onto something special years ago but they've now ruined it.
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  #8  
Old 08-11-2013, 12:08 PM
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A lot of these people complaining about TNA's hiring practices are people that have been saying "Well this is the year that TNA goes out of business" every year since around the mid 2000's. You know, the same people that laugh at every "mistake" TNA makes and go "LOL TNA!" when TNA gets less than a 1.0 rating. The people that say whenever a WWE wrestler gets fired, he'll automatically go to TNA and be their World Champion within a month or two. (Right....so where is DH Smith, Vladimir Kozlov, Deuce and Domino, Manu, Eric Escobar, MVP, John Morrison, KC James, Armando Estrada and all of the other wrestlers no longer in WWE? I know! They're in TNA where each one of them have been world champion at least once! ) The people that think WWE can do no wrong and hope TNA goes out of business. In other words, complete idiots. You can find a lot of them on the main page under the news articles.

Did people that only watch TNA laugh and call Marcus Cor Von, Braden Walker and others "TNA rejects"?
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  #9  
Old 08-11-2013, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProWrestlingFan View Post
Whenever a former WWE wrestler goes to TNA many people start complaining and saying "another WWE reject" etc.

But didn't WWE do the same in the 90s?

Wrestlers who WWE took from NWA/WCW :

"Stunning" Steve Austin
"Mean" Mark Callus (Undertaker)
Jean Paul Levesque (HHH)
Lex Luger
Sid Vicious (Sycho Sid)
Kevin Nash/Oz (Diesel)
Scott Hall/The Diamond Studd - (Razor Ramon)
Chris Jericho, Kane etc

WWF took most of the wrestlers from NWA/WCW except Rock (WWE's only homegrown star)

Wrestlers going back and forth between companies has been going on for decades. It's no different today, where if a wrestler has no work in WWE, or doesn't like working there they go to TNA...they have an option, so they take it.

Discuss.
There's a world of difference between what WWE did in the 90's and what TNA does today.

Right now TNA is taking talent who have either been released by the WWE because they need seasoning (Chris Masters, Ken Kennedy), are not ready for what WWE wanted them to do (Matt Morgan, Luke Gallows) or on the odd occasion have blotted their copybook with Vince (Jeff, RVD, Kurt) and he chose to let them go... TNA sees every ex-WWE guy they can get as a boost to their TV ratings, and another step closer to the perception of them being legit competition. Occasionally, when Vince throws a curveball like Kennedy then it can work well - they guy has become more of a "hand" in TNA than he would have been for the WWE. Someone like Hardy and Angle was a "steal" but came loaded with risk, that has not always paid off as both have had major cock ups but definitely raised TNA's profile.

Early 90's - 90-93, Vince was picking up young talents in the main, Callous, Scott Hall and Nash were all big men who had had some seasoning and Vince felt could improve with a WWE run. Hall had the most experience but Nash clearly had the genetic advantage. Vince could pick them up cheap, put them with established stars with new gimmicks and let them evolve... Taker started with Brother Love but only clicked once Bearer was in the mix, Hall was working with Flair and his former tag partner Hennig and Nash was paired with Shawn who gave him the "crash course" in the WWE way of doing things.

What WWE was doing in the mid 90's was cherry picking frustrated talents from WCW. ECW, The Indy scene and Japan... guys like Steve Austin were not high profile captures, it was a no-risk gamble - as Bischoff had already binned him and his alternative was ECW or Japan. They knew Austin had the ring skill and he just started to show charisma when they signed him...

Mick Foley and Ron Simmons were not high profile captures, but solid signings for particular roles WWE wanted filling. Simmons had pedigree, but that he ended up in the gladiator costume proves Vince didn't care he'd had the WCW title... he had wanted a bad ass, african american brawler for many years, going through Butch Reed, Bad News Brown and Tony Atlas... Simmons fit that bill and he was much more successful than any of the others... Foley was a worker who could be "fed to Taker" but not be horrible in the ring or for all Foley's craziness, unsafe with Taker.... he'd just come off that orbital break thanks to Mabel, they realised that they had to protect him and send him in a different direction. Foley played a big part in schooling the Undertaker to work with smaller guys with better ability, and soon he was learning from Bret and Shawn as well....

The only real "glamour signings" that Vince made during those times from WCW were guys like Ric Flair, Sid in 1991, Lex Luger, Paul Wight and to a lesser extent Brian Pillman. Pillman was signed before his crash and I am certain he was the guy planned to feud with Bret and lead Attitude as a concept with Austin more of a secondary feud/partner in crime for him. Disagree, imagine Pillman fully fit at KOTR, does Austin win that title and make that promo? or does Pillman? Once Brian was out of action I have no doubt he clued Austin into what he had going as they were friends and let him run with it rather than waste it... Pillman was a glamour signing though, Bischoff tried to claim he let Pillman go cos he was "crazy" but no, simple he didn't renew his contract in time and Pillman used what time had left there to shop window himself... remember he'd been a Horseman just months prior, so he was very much a big name.

Wight was a definite steal and Vince has more than been vindicated as Show is now 14 years into his WWE career, that he was ever The Giant is a blip. By the time Jericho came in, who was perhaps the last of this type of signing then the game was up, it was known WCW was becoming a cesspool and that anyone not part of the NWO would jump if the chance came... No one was remotely shocked that Benoit and Co. all came over, just at how little resistance WCW actually put up.

Luger wasn't even a steal from WCW as he was brought in as part of the WBF and when that failed (and he'd been in a bike crash so he never even appeared) they had a contract they had to pay... so he wrestled for them instead...

Sid was their one attempt at a new Hogan based on look alone, Sid Justice was actually not a bad idea but Sid Eudy being a sandwich short of a picnic and addicted to softball were not on the script, but while he was an up and comer in WCW, he was not a main eventer yet.

The pattern is that almost all the guys Vince did sign from WCW in the 90's are more strongly identified by that WWE character/stint than their WCW runs, they made more money and had more critical and creative success... Good as Stunning Steve was, Stone Cold will always be remembered. As much as Farooq misfired at the start, Ron Simmons is now remembered more for the APA and Damn than beating Vader, Dustin Rhodes will be Goldust forevermore and Pillman is remembered as the guy who pulled a gun rather than the high flyer of early 90's WCW...Mick Foley, well he managed to have a career no-one ever dreamed of, much less himself off the back of Vince's original plan to feed Manson the Mutilator to Taker... Guys like Luger, Flair all had moments in WCW after their WWF runs, but they are not "good moments", from Sid's leg to Flair dressed as a woman... hell even Luger showing up on Nitro in a frilly shirt was not the best thing he could have done....

Now look at those TNA guys who were once in the WWE and name one who is gonna be remembered more for their TNA run, in a good way? That's why people are down on TNA signing people, it's not an alternate step or a better one, it's a step down every time... I prefer guys like MVP, Harry Smith and Shelton Benjamin who didn't go that route and went to Japan or ROH rather than take the TNA money (cos they'd have gotten it) but they know that one day they'll be back in WWE and TNA is only gonna delay that day or make it not happen for them... they used to call TNA "Where the Big Boys Play" now, with it's current situation, it's more "Where careers go to die".

For someone like Christian, they got out at the right time and are now better for that time, but not because of it... Not seeing Christian in the WWE for a few years made the fans miss him enough that when he came back with that main event experience of carrying a company, the missing piece was filled in and he got his chance... but he could have still succeeded without TNA at all, if Vince had had faith...

I am a strong believer he releases some guys knowing they will go to TNA, hate it but be pushed to the moon and come back at least a little more prepared for the big push... We'll soon see no doubt when Matt Morgan resurfaces...
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  #10  
Old 08-11-2013, 12:17 PM
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they are the same fukin wrestler. they dont do anything that separates them from when the were in wwe. pretty much all the guys you listed are not the same character they were in wcw/nwa.

also, they let the wwe guys get ahead of the tna guys when its not deserved. i really believed that in samoa joe, aj styles, and christopher daniels were the future of tna, but the future of tna are the guys that gets released by wwe and the older wrestlers
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