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  #11  
Old 11-19-2012, 10:36 AM
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I agree with what the Brain said. The guys you mentioned would be slaughtered by the previous era midcards and perhaps the other eras. There are reasons for that. The training of the performers is quite different. The midcarders of the eighties etc, were part of the territory system and if they weren't main event in WWE, they might have been main event somewhere else, they were in most instances better workers and the feuds they were involved in were better developed.

Carlito
Solid talent on the mike and in the ring. Failed by poor booking and lack of creative vision for his character. Wasted opportunity.

Shelton Benjamin

Solid in th ring, not good on the mike. Killed with the Momma's boy gimmick, just stupid booking by WWE.

Ken Kennedy

Solid on the mike, was okay in the ring from what I saw (little as it was). Biggest shot was winning MITB, then he gets injured and then sometime later he gets bounced from WWE

MVP

Horrible gimmick to start off with. Decent on the mike, ok in the ring but again bad booking and no direction with his character.

Matt Hardy

I'm not a huge fan of the Hardy Boys, but I sort of understand their appeal. They do high risk moves and they are unconventional. Matt Hardy wasn't the star that Jeff was, had difficulty on the mike and was ok in the ring. Clearly better as part of the tag team than on his own.

Booker T

Solid performer, underrated on the mike and in the ring. He can do a lot more than a spinning kick as some people would suggest. He should have been in the main event a lot sooner, he had the fan support, but backstage bs politics comes into play again.

Finlay & William Regal

Both in the same category, seasoned veterans who knew how to work not overwhelmingly great on the mike but helped to put over up and coming performers, or be in a meaningful feud with them.

Another guy mentioned ....

Chris Masters

Had a look, never really saw what he had to offer. Killed by booking and lack of creative ideas for him.
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  #12  
Old 11-19-2012, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brain View Post
I don't have a problem with any of the guys you've listed but honestly that looks like the weakest mid card during my enitre time as a fan, and that includes today. Here's a long list of just some mid card talent from different eras.

That list actually looks like a really weak mid card to me. Go all the way back to the mid 80s.

Ricky Steamboat
Don Muraco
Tito Santana
Greg Valentine
Cowboy Bob Orton
Junk Yard Dog
Randy Savage

What about the late 80s into the early 90s?

Ted Dibiase
Rick Rude
Jake Roberts
Brutus Beefcake
Mr. Perfect
Rick Martel
Jim Duggan
Dusty Rhodes

Mid to late 90s

Shawn Michaels
Razor Ramon
Owen Hart
Davey Boy Smith
Jeff Jarrett
Goldust
123 Kid
Goldust
Faarooq
Mankind
Steve Austin
Triple H
The Rock

Early to mid 2000s

Chris Jericho
Chris Benoit
Eddie Guerrero
Edge
Rey Mysterio
Rob Van Dam
John Cena

Today

Wade Barrett
Dolph Ziggler
Alberto Del Rio
Kofi Kingston
Cody Rhodes
Daniel Bryan
Miz

Say what you will about the WWE Hall of Fame but most of the guys on the earlier lists are in there. So many guys made it to the main event. We'll never see any of the mid card guys from the mid 2000s there besides Booker T who is probably more associated with the guys on my early 2000s list.

Once again, I don't have a problem with any of the guys on your list but besides Booker T I don't think a single one is better than anybody on my lists.
There are a couple factors your overlooking that add bias to your point.

1) Back in the day the mid-card was better defined because there was only one champ. In addition if you go back to Hogan's heyday the main event was made up of Hogan and whatever monster he was fueding with. Everyone else was a mid-carder. with one title there is only so many guys who can be invovled in main event fueds. But with the 2 title system you currently have a main event picture that features:

CM Punk
Ryback
Cena
Big Show
Sheamus
Orton
Del Rio
Ziggler
Kane
Daniel Bryan

That is alot of talent that is either directly in title fueds, or involved in the main event picture in another fashion. Could you imagine how strong the midcard would be if there was only 1 title and half the guys on this list were featured on the midcard?

2) There is enough time and histroy for the guys who were in previous midcards to make a name for themselves and cement their status as main eventers and current or future HOF's. Guys who are currently midcarders are younger guys with their best years ahead of them. There is just no way of telling if guys like Barrett or Rhodes will go down as all time greats, or if guys who are somewhere inbetween midcard and main event like Del Rio, Ziggler and Bryan will do the same.
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  #13  
Old 11-19-2012, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fabulous Rougeau's View Post
There are a couple factors your overlooking that add bias to your point.

1) Back in the day the mid-card was better defined because there was only one champ. In addition if you go back to Hogan's heyday the main event was made up of Hogan and whatever monster he was fueding with. Everyone else was a mid-carder. with one title there is only so many guys who can be invovled in main event fueds. But with the 2 title system you currently have a main event picture that features:

CM Punk
Ryback
Cena
Big Show
Sheamus
Orton
Del Rio
Ziggler
Kane
Daniel Bryan

That is alot of talent that is either directly in title fueds, or involved in the main event picture in another fashion. Could you imagine how strong the midcard would be if there was only 1 title and half the guys on this list were featured on the midcard?

2) There is enough time and histroy for the guys who were in previous midcards to make a name for themselves and cement their status as main eventers and current or future HOF's. Guys who are currently midcarders are younger guys with their best years ahead of them. There is just no way of telling if guys like Barrett or Rhodes will go down as all time greats, or if guys who are somewhere inbetween midcard and main event like Del Rio, Ziggler and Bryan will do the same.
Your first point is a good one but as for the rest of your post there is one big thing you're overlooking. My response was to the op about the mid card from around 2006-2008. I mentioned in my response that I think today's mid card is better than the mid card from a few years ago. I hope some of the guys in the mid card now do go on to become main event guys and hall of famers. The guys I was responding about, Benjamin, Carlito, MVP, Kennedy, etc., will not be going into the hall of fame. That's the group I was talking about.
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  #14  
Old 11-20-2012, 03:37 PM
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I agree that having 2 world titles distorts the mid card status of several wrestlers. With one title you have 4 main event guys really. If you had 1 world title you would have Punk, Cena, Sheamus and Orton as really the top main eventers. Big Show, Del Rio, D. Bryan, Kane would be upper mid card occasional title challenger. It greatly affects the mid card picture. You don't have people like Rock-HHH fighting over the IC belt. Who does Kofi Kingston or Antonio Cesaro have to feud with for there belts long term.
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  #15  
Old 11-20-2012, 09:33 PM
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It is time to unify the titles. Having Cena, Orton, Punk, Ryback, Sheamus etc all chasing 1 title will keep the main event scene fresh. You will have more different feud options so nothing gets stale.

The midcard scene will improve because you dont have to force guys like Del Rio into the world title picture for months.

And its getting a little silly when Ziggler gets advertised as a Raw Superstar and is holding the Smackdown MITB briefcase. Brand Extension needs to end.

Raw's during the Attitude Era were great because you had all the top stars angles being played out on 1 show (Austin, Rock, D-X, Foley, Taker etc). They could do the same with Cena, Orton, Punk, etc. Imagine if they combined the roster and went back to 2 hour Raws. Raw would be really action packed with no filler. Turn Smackdown into the secondary show instead of a secondary brand.

Last edited by XXJJ : 11-20-2012 at 09:36 PM.
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